Good article on hypereutectic pistons in this months Mod. Mustangs - 2003-04 Mach 1 Registry Owners Club

macher03 · 03-06-2006, 07:18 AM

Hey, all

There is a great article on the hypereutectic pistons in our Mustangs in this months issue. I don't want to give away all that the article states, but according to several experts like Mike Schropp, our pistons can handle up to eight psi of boost, or no more than a 125 shot of funny gas. Another expert like Nick Beaudoin suggests 10 to 12 psi, or 125 shot. THEY ALL AGREE THE KEY IS THE TUNE!!

Now, I'm not a motorhead, so maybe this is old hat for some of you, but for a rookie, it was fairly enlightening. I encourage you to go out and buy the magizine, and read it for yourself. The articles are good, and for you "hottie of the day" thread subscribers out there, the model is pretty hot they used to promote Turbonetics.

98StangRidah · 03-06-2006, 08:58 AM

This has been the conclusion among many people already. Still, I think you're on borrowed time even if you go only 8psi.

Roy · 03-06-2006, 09:10 AM

Ive never heard of any piston problems. Its always the rods breaking. With a good tune a 150 shot wouldnt scare me.

Phil · 03-06-2006, 09:37 AM

The 125 max is taking into consideration that pump gas of about 93 octane is being used. I was running the 150 shot on the street a couple of times before I put her up for the winter. I always run Cam II unleaded 100 octane and J. Chambers tunes for 95-97 octane, always have to keep a safety factor for detonation. This year he will be tunning me N/A for 97 octane & the 150/175 shot for 97 octane.

The piston top ring land can crack and the motor still run like there is nothing wrong for a while. But, usually it's the rod that breaks under detonation or just to much hp. Max limit of our factory motors with right fuel, plugs & tune would be around 450 rwhp. Which is what I'm shooting for, last year on the 125 shot the Mach was making 410 rwhp on J. Chambers Mustang Dyno.

SteelwingDSG · 03-06-2006, 11:55 AM

Say you have a cracked piston ring. I imagine the only way of knowing is to have the engine taken apart and examined. What are the costs involved if there in fact is a cracked ring? And what do you think the costs are if there isn't (labor)?

Thanks!

lxh89 · 03-06-2006, 01:53 PM

I think he's referring to the ring land which is the groove in the piston where the ring resides. If it gets damaged, typically a leakdown test will reveal it assuming the valves are sealing well.

Replacement cost if you really wanted to be cheap is pull the motor, disassemble only that rod/piston, get an autozone hone, re-hone the cylinder then replace only the piston and rings then put it back together. Frankly, I wouldnt recommend this method unless you plan to do the work yourself and literally don't have the cash to do it right and need transporation ASAP.

Also, I have been wondering since the mach 1s have the high compression pistons if the distance between the 1st ring land and the top of the piston is greater in comparison to the lower compression pistons (ala GT).

Tony

SteelwingDSG · 03-06-2006, 02:12 PM

Well, I'm 95% sure that because of my tune (my MAF setup), fuel is making its way into the oil-pan (see my yellow gunk thread). Is it possible for fuel to get down there without having a crack in a piston ring?

Tomcat427 · 03-06-2006, 03:56 PM

I happen to have this at work. It is the last time my car was on the dyno, 4/26/05. 452 rwhp with a 52 fuel 62 nitrous setting (150 shot at the wheels). 298 rwhp n/a on the nitrous tune. I have upgraded the fuel system, C&L, full exhaust and full drivetrain. Tuned with an SCT 4 bank chip. (Stock, N/A race, Nitrous pump gas, Nitrous race gas)

SSmith440 · 03-06-2006, 11:39 PM

hyper pistons=junk powdered rods=junk. Scott

Tomcat427 · 03-06-2006, 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SSmith440

hyper pistons=junk powdered rods=junk. Scott

45,000 + miles and 30 bottles of nitrous oxide. I'll take it.

Yes, I know there is a lot better out there. But there is also a lot worse that has been mass produced in the past.

Brain · 03-07-2006, 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tomcat427

45,000 + miles and 30 bottles of nitrous oxide. I'll take it.

Yes, I know there is a lot better out there. But there is also a lot worse that has been mass produced in the past.

Still junk, Tomcat. Just kidding.

Actually, there is nothing wrong with hypereutectic pistons.
- They were produced with small ring lands to reduce trapped gasses in the walls to reduce emissions. Small lands can't take TOO much cylinder pressure. This is a matter is shape and not casting material.
- They were designed with high silicon content to reduce expansion. This reduces cold start noise ("Ford, my new Mustang is making a knocking sound when cold....") and emissions.

They were not intended to be used at over 500-hp. They meet the design criteria and satisfy 90% of the buyers. They are not junk.

The rods are fine also. If running higher RPM, use better bolts. Taking it further, replace the rods.

What is the issue? You can crack an old 5.0 block before you crack a piston or snap a rod a STOCK 4V motor with the proper tune.

DarkShadow · 03-07-2006, 10:12 AM

subscribing

VoodooMACH · 03-07-2006, 07:50 PM

My pos put down 570ft/lbs with 52,000 miles and over 50 bottles LOL.... no problems here... That's alot of juice.

Phil · 03-07-2006, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mach1Marauder

Then how come you're slower than hell?

LMAO!!! I think I'm going to tipy toe out on this one!

Brain · 03-08-2006, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mach1Marauder

Then how come you're slower than hell?

It's the damned weak transmission!

04azuremach · 03-08-2006, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mach1Marauder

450+HP/529+TQ 17K miles BUNCHES OF 1/4 mile passes and BUNCHES of bottles

Consider yourself lucky... a total of 5 trips to the track and NO spray, or ANY power adder and I had not one, but THREE spun rod bearings on the stock block. 1 was real bad, but after further inspection they found 2 others that were failing. Oh well, it's all forged for me from here on out. Not that the materials had much to do with my spun bearing, but at least I've got race bearings now.

Frankie · 03-09-2006, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mach4mark

Hey, all
There is a great article on the hypereutectic pistons in our Mustangs in this months issue.

Mach4mark,
Which magazine ?? I think I got the March MM&FF and didn't see anything in there.

Thanks,
Frank

macher03 · 03-09-2006, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frankie

Mach4mark,
Which magazine ?? I think I got the March MM&FF and didn't see anything in there.

Thanks,
Frank

Its the Modified Mustangs magazine. There is a red C-500 Shelby clone on the cover. Sorry for the confusion!

03-06-2006, 07:18 AM	#1
macher03 Grab your gear... Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Western North Carolina Posts: 1,324	Good article on hypereutectic pistons in this months Mod. Mustangs Hey, all There is a great article on the hypereutectic pistons in our Mustangs in this months issue. I don't want to give away all that the article states, but according to several experts like Mike Schropp, our pistons can handle up to eight psi of boost, or no more than a 125 shot of funny gas. Another expert like Nick Beaudoin suggests 10 to 12 psi, or 125 shot. THEY ALL AGREE THE KEY IS THE TUNE!! Now, I'm not a motorhead, so maybe this is old hat for some of you, but for a rookie, it was fairly enlightening. I encourage you to go out and buy the magizine, and read it for yourself. The articles are good, and for you "hottie of the day" thread subscribers out there, the model is pretty hot they used to promote Turbonetics. __________________ Turbo-charged 2003 OxFord White Mach 1 "Mandy" Custom tuned by Amazon Tuning Solutions SOLD 11/01/10 1994 Mustang GT Grabber Blue Roadcar "Roxy" SOLD 10/23/2011 Two defining forces died for you. Jesus Christ died for your soul. The American Soldier died for your freedom. Think about it. 'Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not.' ~ Thomas Jefferson

03-06-2006, 08:58 AM	#2
98StangRidah Where'd my zafu go? Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Grand Rapids, MI Posts: 2,707	Re: Good article on hypereutectic pistons in this months Mod. Mustangs This has been the conclusion among many people already. Still, I think you're on borrowed time even if you go only 8psi. __________________ For Sale: 2004 Comp. Orange Mach1 - purchased 3/26/2005 Exhaust MRT H-Pipe with cats Magnaflow catback Suspension Bilstein struts & shocks Steeda sport springs MM - caster/camber plates, steering rack bushings, swaybar bushings and endlinks 18x9 Bullits with Michlein PS2s in 255/40 Other stuff - MGW shifter, MRT hood struts and black exhaust tips, SCT tune, PHP spacer

03-06-2006, 09:10 AM	#3
Roy Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: S.E. Mich. Posts: 3,446	Re: Good article on hypereutectic pistons in this months Mod. Mustangs Ive never heard of any piston problems. Its always the rods breaking. With a good tune a 150 shot wouldnt scare me.

03-06-2006, 09:37 AM	#4
Phil Nitrous Junkie Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Ohio Posts: 7,299	Re: Good article on hypereutectic pistons in this months Mod. Mustangs The 125 max is taking into consideration that pump gas of about 93 octane is being used. I was running the 150 shot on the street a couple of times before I put her up for the winter. I always run Cam II unleaded 100 octane and J. Chambers tunes for 95-97 octane, always have to keep a safety factor for detonation. This year he will be tunning me N/A for 97 octane & the 150/175 shot for 97 octane. The piston top ring land can crack and the motor still run like there is nothing wrong for a while. But, usually it's the rod that breaks under detonation or just to much hp. Max limit of our factory motors with right fuel, plugs & tune would be around 450 rwhp. Which is what I'm shooting for, last year on the 125 shot the Mach was making 410 rwhp on J. Chambers Mustang Dyno. __________________ Phil PRB Machining, LLC http://www.prbmachining-absdeleteman...com/index.html Performance mods by Jeff Chambers, the owner/tuner of CRT Performance in Norwalk, Ohio http://www.crt-performance.com/

03-06-2006, 11:55 AM	#5
SteelwingDSG Procharger = Very Fun Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Simi Valley, CA Posts: 877	Re: Good article on hypereutectic pistons in this months Mod. Mustangs Say you have a cracked piston ring. I imagine the only way of knowing is to have the engine taken apart and examined. What are the costs involved if there in fact is a cracked ring? And what do you think the costs are if there isn't (labor)? Thanks!

03-06-2006, 01:53 PM	#6
lxh89 Registered User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Houston, Tx Posts: 1,530	Re: Good article on hypereutectic pistons in this months Mod. Mustangs I think he's referring to the ring land which is the groove in the piston where the ring resides. If it gets damaged, typically a leakdown test will reveal it assuming the valves are sealing well. Replacement cost if you really wanted to be cheap is pull the motor, disassemble only that rod/piston, get an autozone hone, re-hone the cylinder then replace only the piston and rings then put it back together. Frankly, I wouldnt recommend this method unless you plan to do the work yourself and literally don't have the cash to do it right and need transporation ASAP. Also, I have been wondering since the mach 1s have the high compression pistons if the distance between the 1st ring land and the top of the piston is greater in comparison to the lower compression pistons (ala GT). Tony __________________ 2015 Ruby Red Mustang GT Premium Bone Stock 03 Oxford White Mach 1 - SOLD 1.72 60',10.932@131.60MPH, 3800# Raceweight

03-06-2006, 02:12 PM	#7
SteelwingDSG Procharger = Very Fun Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Simi Valley, CA Posts: 877	Re: Good article on hypereutectic pistons in this months Mod. Mustangs Well, I'm 95% sure that because of my tune (my MAF setup), fuel is making its way into the oil-pan (see my yellow gunk thread). Is it possible for fuel to get down there without having a crack in a piston ring?

03-06-2006, 03:56 PM	#8
Tomcat427 What a ride it was :) Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: TX Posts: 4,489	Re: Good article on hypereutectic pistons in this months Mod. Mustangs I happen to have this at work. It is the last time my car was on the dyno, 4/26/05. 452 rwhp with a 52 fuel 62 nitrous setting (150 shot at the wheels). 298 rwhp n/a on the nitrous tune. I have upgraded the fuel system, C&L, full exhaust and full drivetrain. Tuned with an SCT 4 bank chip. (Stock, N/A race, Nitrous pump gas, Nitrous race gas) Attached Thumbnails __________________ No, I didn't do that! Wait maybe I did!

03-06-2006, 11:39 PM	#9
SSmith440 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Marysville Washington Posts: 303	Re: Good article on hypereutectic pistons in this months Mod. Mustangs hyper pistons=junk powdered rods=junk. Scott

03-07-2006, 10:12 AM	#12
DarkShadow Oops...it's a GT500 Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: MACHachusetts Posts: 908	Re: Good article on hypereutectic pistons in this months Mod. Mustangs subscribing __________________ 2007 GT500, black, stripe delete Traded: 03 DSG 5 Spd, Slightly Procharged!!!

03-07-2006, 07:50 PM	#13
VoodooMACH sittin in a parking lot.. Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Katy/Austin, TX Posts: 1,418	Re: Good article on hypereutectic pistons in this months Mod. Mustangs My pos put down 570ft/lbs with 52,000 miles and over 50 bottles LOL.... no problems here... That's alot of juice. __________________ 03 Oxford white Mach... SOLD

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