Wanting cams but maybe intake. Only customs?

[67mustang]

Was thinking... If comp 106100 can make 350-360rwhp...and 98 cobra intake can get 325-335...

What will custom intake only cams get me? Do you think it's possible to get 350rwhp with intake only cams?

Seen a post or two saying just the cobra cams willake 325-335hp well what bout just custom intakes alittle more aggresive...maybe NASvT has something to say?

Here are my current/in my closet waiting to he installed parts.

4.10 gears
Aluminum ds
Jlt rai
Hooker lOngtubes
Bbk offroad x pipe (cut to fit hookers)
Mac cat back
1/2 " intake spacer
90mm MAF


Thinking it's time for some cams.... And if I can make the same power as 106100 with just intake only cams I'd be thrilled...


Post away!!

[musclemerc]

In not NASVT but here you go.

With your current meds you should make 307~312HP, non degreed 96 Cobra cams will add 20hp, degreed will get you 30hp. That puts you pretty close to your goal if you degree them 342hp, throw in a NASVT stock length P&P intake and you should be there.

Have you thought about pullys? NASVT posted part umbers for Innovators West pullys some time ago

[ModularSpeed]

Originally Posted by 67mustang

Was thinking... If comp 106100 can make 350-370rwhp...and 98 cobra intake can get 325-350...

What will custom intake only cams get me? Do you think it's possible to get 350rwhp with intake only cams? Of course it is, people are in the 340's with Cobra Intake cams.

Seen a post or two saying just the cobra cams willake 325-335hp well what bout just custom intakes alittle more aggresive...maybe NASvT has something to say? He will. It will be what I am saying. Yes, it can be done easily.

Here are my current/in my closet waiting to he installed parts.

4.10 gears
Aluminum ds
Jlt rai
Hooker lOngtubes
Bbk offroad x pipe (cut to fit hookers) - Replace with a TRUE X design
Mac cat back - Replace with a straight through muffler design
1/2 " intake spacer
90mm MAF


Thinking it's time for some cams.... And if I can make the same power as 106100 with just intake only cams I'd be thrilled... Looks like you will be thrilled.


Post away!!

Originally Posted by musclemerc

In not NASVT but here you go.

With your current meds you should make 307~312HP Possibly more, mine mad 326 with same mods, non degreed 96 Cobra cams will add 20hp, degreed will get you 30hp <- I am not sure if degreeing will net 10 rwhp over non degreed...but it will have a much nicer power curve. That puts you pretty close to your goal if you degree them 342hp, throw in a NASVT stock length P&P intake and you should be there. NOTE: The highest powered Cobra Intake set-ups have come from non-degreed Intake Cams. Not saying you shouldnt degree them, but just stating that if peak HP is the only goal...you may not gain anything by degreeing them. This all depends on a few variables of course. I dont think minde would have went from 346 to 350+ rwhp...but I know for a fact I would make better TQ and have a better curve.

Have you thought about pullys? NASVT posted part umbers for Innovators West pullys some time ago March?

Hope that helps.

[67mustang]

Right now without the lontubes installed I'm making 305rwhp....and car has been 12.70 on street tires....

Hoping that I can buy a set of intake only cams for $350 I think it was and degree them and add the longtubes and a ported stock intake and the 90mm and make 350rwhp and 325 torque or so.... more the better.... As long as my curves good not some peaky junk.

[na svt]

Originally Posted by 67mustang

Hoping that I can buy a set of intake only cams for $350 I think it was and degree them and add the longtubes and a ported stock intake and the 90mm and make 350rwhp and 325 torque or so.... more the better.... As long as my curves good not some peaky junk.

340 is not the norm for cobra cams since most cars do not have a/c, and hydraboost deletes. I'd say 330-335 is more like it.

-96-98, 99/01 cams, not degreed, 20rw
-96-98, 99/01 cobra cams degreed, 20-25rw but the mid range and tq gaisn are enormous
-Custom intake cams will add 35-40rw and will get you to 350rw.

I can get you 99/01 intakes for $185 shipped
Reground intake cams are $350
Custom ground intake cams are $650
Custom cams (all 4) are $1300

[na svt]

degreed vs. undegreed:

[311-420]

Todd-

What would it cost to have you spec a set of intake cams for my car, have them ground and verified by you afterwards, let me fly you over here to install/degree them and fly you back?

Seriously..

[na svt]

Originally Posted by 311-420

Todd-

What would it cost to have you spec a set of intake cams for my car, have them ground and verified by you afterwards, let me fly you over here to install/degree them and fly you back?

Seriously..

where is "over here?"

[311-420]

Originally Posted by na svt

where is "over here?"

Fly into DFW. I pick you up and I live 1 hour north in Sherman. I would also take you back to the airport, etc.

[67mustang]

So what can I expect from just custom reground intake only cams for $350.
Better then 98 cobras degreed?

Also since there reground do you have to buy lash caps?

[Bmeagher]

Originally Posted by 311-420

Todd-

What would it cost to have you spec a set of intake cams for my car, have them ground and verified by you afterwards, let me fly you over here to install/degree them and fly you back?

Seriously..

Almost makes more sense you to drive there, only 12-13 hours. And then he has all is tools at home.

[311-420]

"not interested" is a perfectly fine answer, Todd. I'm not easily offended.

In hindsight, I guess I put you on the spot. My apologies.

[na svt]

Originally Posted by 311-420

"not interested" is a perfectly fine answer, Todd. I'm not easily offended.

In hindsight, I guess I put you on the spot. My apologies.

I think it would be a nice way to spend a weekend

[nickmckinney]

Originally Posted by 67mustang

So what can I expect from just custom reground intake only cams for $350.
Better then 98 cobras degreed?

Also since there reground do you have to buy lash caps?

I have never found a lash cap for these that fit under the stock rocker tip.

The regrind series I just designed one size has the lash adjuster compressed 040 which is fine if the lash adjusters are good and not gummed up inside and the other required shims under the lash adjusters which we sourced from ARP. All the regular washers at the hardware store I was not impressed with how all over the place the thicknesses were so using them as shims you need to really look closely at your lash adjuster preload.

[na svt]

Originally Posted by 67mustang

So what can I expect from just custom reground intake only cams for $350.
Better then 98 cobras degreed?

Also since there reground do you have to buy lash caps?

No caps, in fact you can get enough duration from the stock cams without shimming, longer valves or lash caps.

Most people want too much duration or they want a "cool" idle. The cool idle is not conducive to power and requires an amount of duration that kills tq and midrange power. I always tell people that less is better but they insist on more becuase "someone in the internet made XXX power with xxx duration"

[tad240]

Originally Posted by na svt

No caps, in fact you can get enough duration from the stock cams without shimming, longer valves or lash caps.

Most people want too much duration or they want a "cool" idle. The cool idle is not conducive to power and requires an amount of duration that kills tq and midrange power. I always tell people that less is better but they insist on more becuase "someone in the internet made XXX power with xxx duration"

OK Todd, I've got two Questions:

1. So how much duration can you get on a regrind without needing shims?

2. How well (performance - not cool idle) would longer duration regrind cams (intake only) work if coupled with the stock exhaust cams on... say an FR500 intake with long tubes, etc.? Would this combo really be able to take advantage of the FR500 short runners? If so, for $350 buck regrinds that would be a good deal.

[na svt]

Originally Posted by tad240

OK Todd, I've got two Questions:
1. So how much duration can you get on a regrind without needing shims?

Originally Posted by tad240

2. How well (performance - not cool idle) would longer duration regrind cams (intake only) work if coupled with the stock exhaust cams on... say an FR500 intake with long tubes, etc.? Would this combo really be able to take advantage of the FR500 short runners? If so, for $350 buck regrinds that would be a good deal.

The stock exhaust cams when combined with longer duration intake cams aren't the best match for an FR500 intake'd combo. High RPM power requires more exh duration when longer dur intake cams are used. In this case, if the intake cams have 215 degrees, I'd like the exh cams to have 212-215 degrees.

[Bmeagher]

What would the max duration you'd like for both int and exh, with .425 lift?

[nickmckinney]

Originally Posted by Bmeagher

What would the max duration you'd like for both int and exh, with .425 lift?

We have a set of 220/222 425/425 on the way that will need a 065 shim from the math we did, I will know for sure next week when they arrive. Here is a picture of the lash adjuster in the head, you can see the oil feed is the top hole next to the lash adjuster. You get more than about 065 you really start pinching down the area to feed the oil to the adjuster so thats where we stopped. You can probably run a 225 intake duration cam with a shim and have about half the adjuster preload (which is use able) I would guess. After I measure out these 220/222 in a head we will see how much further this can be pushed and still be "bolt on"

[tad240]

Are there any drawbacks / negatives with the regrinds vs billet? (Other than the obvious limitations of excessive lifts & long durations) Are the regrinds as durable, stable, reliable, etc.?

[Bmeagher]

Originally Posted by nickmckinney

We have a set of 220/222 425/425 on the way that will need a 065 shim from the math we did, I will know for sure next week when they arrive. Here is a picture of the lash adjuster in the head, you can see the oil feed is the top hole next to the lash adjuster. You get more than about 065 you really start pinching down the area to feed the oil to the adjuster so thats where we stopped. You can probably run a 225 intake duration cam with a shim and have about half the adjuster preload (which is use able) I would guess. After I measure out these 220/222 in a head we will see how much further this can be pushed and still be "bolt on"

Why are shims needed?

[nickmckinney]

Originally Posted by tad240

Are there any drawbacks / negatives with the regrinds vs billet? (Other than the obvious limitations of excessive lifts & long durations) Are the regrinds as durable, stable, reliable, etc.?

I would not use the regrinds with a monster valve spring as the nose is pressed on. Otherwise as long as the lash adjuster preload is in spec there are no other issues than what you listed.

[nickmckinney]

Originally Posted by Bmeagher

Why are shims needed?

Because to make a "bigger" duration and/or lift the only place we can remove material from a current lobe is the base circle. Removing material here makes the base circle smaller which lowers the preload on the lash adjuster. Aftermarket billets start out monster oversized and when finished they have the same base circle as stock cams even with monster lifts and durations.

The base circle of a cam is the round portion of the lobe that has the valve at zero lift. On a stock modular cam it measures ~1.9 inches diameter.

[na svt]

Going too small with the base circle and then only shimming the aduster can cause issues with the valvetrain alignment which results in thrown followers. However, I don't know the point (base circle, shim thickness) where those issues begin to occur.

As for the max shim thickness, I've seen .100" used in conjunction with .100" longer valves and they had no issues.

[nickmckinney]

I would agree that if you were careful you could do 0.1" of shim. However I have to plan on each person not having a clue what to look for when installing them so I stopped at 065 which is 100% safe.

I have seen people throw rockers with perfect valve train alignment. If the lash adjuster is gummed up or sticky inside and wants to try to stay compressed its going to tick first then possibly throw the rocker if the clearance is big enough. 9 times out of 10 the rocker bends the top of the valve stem over on its exit. I don't use used lash adjusters anymore because of this as even just doing a valve job on a 4V you can easily move the lash adjuster preload 015 if you wanted (and I do it on purpose for some high RPM heads) 99.9% of used clean lash adjusters are cool with that change but that last 0.1% costs a fortune when it bites you.