For those that roadcourse...

[Machy uno]

Hoping to get insight to running a wider tire up front on the Mach. Background - non daily driver, fully built suspension for roadcourse fun (subframe connectors, STB, MM k-member, a-arms, coil overs, MM LCA's, MM panhard bar, MM torque arm, etc, etc). Garage queen that sees occasional street time on nice days and is driven within a few hours for track events.

Big problem is it still exhibits under steer. I'm currently 18x9 front and 18x10 rear. Staggered set up can cause some problems (ie, make under steer more pronounced) but I'm not convinced switching to 9's in the rear will improve handling. Maybe make it under steer less but not get me around the turns faster. I tried mounting my rears on the front and the rim offset hits the caliper (big brake kit). My thought is run a 3/16" spacer to make it work and swap out the front 9's for 10" wide.

The wider tires will certainly make the car track more on open straight roads, but thoughts from anyone for a mostly track use set-up? Please, the whole it'll look 4x4 and it's blasphemy, and it's a horrible idea aren't really what I'm looking for. Anyone track there car and have thoughts for someone in my position?

-Darren

[White2003Mach1]

i've got all the braces(k member, front STB, rear STB) FL SFC welded in, jacking rails are tied into SFC, sa konis, h&r SS, weight jacker LCA, sa UCA
but i don't have all the MM that you've got

a friend(MisterL on here) borrowed a set of chassis scales when we did his k member swap and we scaled both our cars(just the rear no way to do the front without coilovers)
the one thing i did different was i pulled the OEM style sway bar off and put an aftermarket swaybar (that actually ties the body to the axle)
http://www.steeda.com/79-04-mustang-...ybar-006-1sta/
i've got 18s with 285s on back and 255s up front

the mustang will always have a tendency to understeer but with scaling and aftermarket swaybar my car is very easy to control on tight corners
i have a {bad?} habit of steering with the throttle for what that's worth

i imagine things are pretty tight under the rear of your car as it is(with all the MM stuff) but the swaybar might be something to look into as well as checking the balance of the car

[mach1metalhead]

Originally Posted by White2003Mach1

i've got all the braces(k member, front STB, rear STB) FL SFC welded in, jacking rails are tied into SFC, sa konis, h&r SS, weight jacker LCA, sa UCA
but i don't have all the MM that you've got

a friend(MisterL on here) borrowed a set of chassis scales when we did his k member swap and we scaled both our cars(just the rear no way to do the front without coilovers)
the one thing i did different was i pulled the OEM style sway bar off and put an aftermarket swaybar (that actually ties the body to the axle)
http://www.steeda.com/79-04-mustang-...ybar-006-1sta/
i've got 18s with 285s on back and 255s up front

the mustang will always have a tendency to understeer but with scaling and aftermarket swaybar my car is very easy to control on tight corners
i have a {bad?} habit of steering with the throttle for what that's worth

i imagine things are pretty tight under the rear of your car as it is(with all the MM stuff) but the swaybar might be something to look into as well as checking the balance of the car

Do you have pics of how this works? I have the Eibach front and rear bars, but that sounds like a decent upgrade still. The bar I have ties the two LCAs together like the stocker, but its much stiffer. How does this incorporate the body?

[iudelt89]

Assuming you have CC plates, all I got for you is a battery relocation. Play with the toe and camber a bit.

Mine doesn't understeer too badly. When it does, I just compensate a bit with my right foot. I'm running 18x9 w/ 275s up front, and 18x10 w/ 285s out back. Mod list in sig.

The engine is slug way out in front. You are likely always going to have a bit of understeer. Just the natural behavior of the car.

Nekasrof (Mr. Evil) will probably chime in here. He's got more experience with mach suspension set ups than anyone else I'd think.

[Machy uno]

Originally Posted by iudelt89

Assuming you have CC plates, all I got for you is a battery relocation. Play with the toe and camber a bit.

Mine doesn't understeer too badly. When it does, I just compensate a bit with my right foot. I'm running 18x9 w/ 275s up front, and 18x10 w/ 285s out back. Mod list in sig.

The engine is slug way out in front. You are likely always going to have a bit of understeer. Just the natural behavior of the car.

Nekasrof (Mr. Evil) will probably chime in here. He's got more experience with mach suspension set ups than anyone else I'd think.

I do compensate with the right foot a bit as well but really looking to get around the turns faster. While the driver mod is ever increasing I'm pretty sure I've come close to what this car can do in it's current state. 2 track weekends on the front NT-05's with wire belt starting to show lets me know they're being pushed to the max!

No clue how I've managed to get everything done to my car that I have and still have the stock sway bars. Those will be swapped out before long to help.

Also having over heating issues but only at track rpms (ie, extended time above 4.5-5k). New radiator and water pump will hopefully fix the issue.

[Machy uno]

For the battery, that's in the plan. I have the full stock interior and even have a nice stereo. Good thing about that is the amp in the back was run with large enough power wire I can most likely tie into that for relocation purposes. I could gut the car, remove ac, stereo, back seat, etc, but this thing is still my sunday fun car in addition to the track. I like it the way it is!

[White2003Mach1]

i'll see if i can't get some pics for you tomorrow

i did completely away with the OEM bar(it was hitting the tailpipes and hung way too low)when i installed the weight jackers
i never saw the function of the OEM bar with just being tied between the LCAs, i know i've seen many different cars, of all makes that have a similar setup, but to reduce body roll the body has to be connected to something that isn't going to move side to side, i'm not any kind of engineer or racer and this is just my opinion and i imagine the MFGs figured this setup was good enough and cheap to produce

i've got the bigger 1 3/8" tubular bar up front also, probably the same size you've got

[iudelt89]

Originally Posted by Machy uno

I do compensate with the right foot a bit as well but really looking to get around the turns faster. While the driver mod is ever increasing I'm pretty sure I've come close to what this car can do in it's current state. 2 track weekends on the front NT-05's with wire belt starting to show lets me know they're being pushed to the max!

No clue how I've managed to get everything done to my car that I have and still have the stock sway bars. Those will be swapped out before long to help.

Also having over heating issues but only at track rpms (ie, extended time above 4.5-5k). New radiator and water pump will hopefully fix the issue.

Interesting that you are having overheating problems. I haven't had any issues so far. Couple of days have been in 90+ degree heat as well.

Also interesting that your fronts are wearing more quickly than the rears. I'm opposite there. Same driving habits. Mostly track time and a few weekend cruises. Still full interior and street tires.

Let me know what you go with/how you like the sway setup when you get there. I have yet to do them as well.

[TKat13]

Originally Posted by White2003Mach1

the one thing i did different was i pulled the OEM style sway bar off and put an aftermarket swaybar (that actually ties the body to the axle)
http://www.steeda.com/79-04-mustang-...ybar-006-1sta/

If I read this correctly, it states that this sway bar is supposed to be used with the OEM sway bar. Meaning, do not remove the OEM and add this one. I would be interested to know if your car improves significantly by reinstalling the OEM as well. I am currently looking into sway bar options, thanks for the link.

[mach1metalhead]

Interesting catch, TKat. I wonder if I could use this on top of my beefy Eibach sway bar and compound the effect.

[Machy uno]

Originally Posted by iudelt89

Interesting that you are having overheating problems. I haven't had any issues so far. Couple of days have been in 90+ degree heat as well.

Also interesting that your fronts are wearing more quickly than the rears. I'm opposite there. Same driving habits. Mostly track time and a few weekend cruises. Still full interior and street tires.

Let me know what you go with/how you like the sway setup when you get there. I have yet to do them as well.

I used to be able to hot lap it session after session without issue in the Texas summers. I've had two coolant flushes in the last 1.5 years and both times was told the coolant was nasty. Had a shop replace the thermostat and check on the fans to make sure they are coming on. I believe the inside of the radiator is simply gunked up and the water pump propeller is worn a bit. Wear and tear parts that have had to over work through the years. Front of the radiator gets worn from crap hitting it and getting stuck in the fins so it's probably lost some of it's cooling ability.

At the track a few weekends ago I actually boiled fluid out the cap while on the track. Happened between the long straight and end of the lap...hit a turn and started sliding out. Looked at the temp and pitted in. Driver tire and fender all wet = not good for traction. Replaced the cap the next morning and properly burped the system myself. Helped, but didn't fix it.

Front tires are much more narrow than the rears as far as a track set up goes. The backs have lived through 4 weekends and I could probably get 1 or 2 more out of them. The fronts were bad enough I was nervous driving home after the second weekend. I also have A LOT of toe out and it was the OUTSIDE edge of the passenger tire that was the worst. While that suggests too low of tire pressure I'm not sure I'm comfortable running higher than 44psi cold (at least sitting as there is no 'cold' in Texas this time of the year). I was still rolling on the outside which gives me the feeling the front is overworking compared to the back so I need to even this situation out.

Stiffen the rear sway bar, loosen the adjustable shocks in the front, move the battery to the rear for a bit better weight distribution, raise the front end using coil-overs a tad and/or wider tires in the front. All should help and some are cheaper than others. I need new front tires anyway at this point so it makes sense to get the new rim size at the same time. On the other hand...I'll run through the next set in two weekend events (around a total of 750 miles) anyway....

[Machy uno]

As reference...

295/35 R18's rear
265/35 R18's front.

Attached is a picture of the driver side (not nearly as bad as the passenger side) after the second weekend. Sticky!