NFL Football Thread

[RobbyB]

Originally Posted by np_mach1

You are delusional. All I know is football. I am one of the most real and honest people break down of talent and teams you will ever meet. You argue out of both sides of your face. You argue for stats then against them. Look, honestly and truth... the Niners are good so far this year. They just have not done enough to say WOW they are a bad *** team. I like the Niners, I do follow all teams closely. Fantasy football, me coaching football part time, and just a love of the game keeps me interested. I can tell you anything you want to know about your team. (just about ) I just don't look at them through rose colored glasses like you do.

When was the last time Braylon edwards or Michael crabtree were relevant?? What? When? Braylon hasn't been the same guy since Cleveland and still dropped the big passes, and Crabtree can't stay healthy, he isn't a burner, and his hands are so-so. You say they could break out if they had to... Jeez talk about hypotheticals. Davis is a beast. top 5 TE in the league easily. He is a physical freak. No way Heath Miller is a better field stretcher, but he has great hands and can block his *** off, which is what Steelers tight ends do. They probably won't have the Tony G, Fred Davis type of TE... just not in their DNA I guess.

Hines ward is a comparable talent to crabtree. Hines gets it done though AND can actually block down field. Hines is the #1 WR for yardage in Steeler history... He is a bad dude. You may watch the games but you dont see the games LOL.

How can people figure out antonio Brown and leave Wallace alone?? pick your poison BUT either way you die. Don't forget about sanders and cotchery. I mean this is full WR corp. Not just 2 guys and some tight ends. We have legit #1 in Wallace, but those other guys are equally as good as the other in Brown and Sanders. our 3rd wr is our #1 wr of all time. **** talk about a shitty squad huh? laughable///

No one is relevant until they make noise in the play offs or unless you're Calvin or Andre Johnson. I'm surprised Patrick Willis gets any respect after playing for the joke of the NFL for the past decade. That doesn't mean they aren't talented. The person you're really not focusing on (nor are defenses) is Delanie Walker. He's lined up at 15 different positions. He can block as good as Miller and catch as good as Vernon Davis. He'd be a starter on 28 other NFL teams. Most of Gore's big runs came behind Walker. He has as many TD's as Davis. If you ever watch a 49ers game, watch number 46. He's not well known, but he's probably the biggest part of the offense no one is talking about. People double up on Vernon, but Walker makes them pay. If they both played in New England in place of hernandez and gronkowski, they'd both be household names.

Crabtree has blocked fine down the field and there's lots of Gore highlights you can see it in. Braylon might block even better. If you look at Braylon's drops, they have gotten less each consecutive season. He is a legitimate receiver and can do the fade route just as good as anyone not named Calvin or Andre. The Niners also lost their most productive receiver in Josh Morgan during their 48-3 rout of the Bucs.

I still say you CAN win in this league without airing it out for 300 yards a game. When it comes to scoring, 200 yards with 0 ints is better than 300 yards with 1 int. In most of the games, the Niners played with a lead and they get super conservative when up by 10 points (minus the bucs game, but they got so many turn overs from them inside their own 40, it made scoring easy). They don't shoot themselves in the foot. Might not be flashy, but it's smart. Alex can throw for 300 yards if need be (he has in previous years).

More about Alex.. did you know under Singletary, he would not allow Smith to audible? He was basically hand cuffed last year. Not allowing one of the smarter QB's in the league to audible is probably the most detrimental thing you can do to an offense. He had no trust. So far, this year, Harbaugh has shown trust and Alex's mistakes have been minimal. Less than any other QB.

[RobbyB]

Originally Posted by np_mach1

Robby, BTW you really are trying to say Santonio didn't get both feet down?? please stop... Just please stop with the crazy

Every time I watch it, it looks like his right foot is touching his left foot, but his toe is above the ground. I always remind people that pick 6 before the half was what determined the game. That's a 14 point swing that should have never happened, but hey, that's football.

[np_mach1]

Originally Posted by RobbyB

No one is relevant until they make noise in the play offs or unless you're Calvin or Andre Johnson. I'm surprised Patrick Willis gets any respect after playing for the joke of the NFL for the past decade. That doesn't mean they aren't talented. The person you're really not focusing on (nor are defenses) is Delanie Walker. He's lined up at 15 different positions. He can block as good as Miller and catch as good as Vernon Davis. He'd be a starter on 28 other NFL teams. Most of Gore's big runs came behind Walker. He has as many TD's as Davis. If you ever watch a 49ers game, watch number 46. He's not well known, but he's probably the biggest part of the offense no one is talking about. People double up on Vernon, but Walker makes them pay. If they both played in New England in place of hernandez and gronkowski, they'd both be household names.

Crabtree has blocked fine down the field and there's lots of Gore highlights you can see it in. Braylon might block even better. If you look at Braylon's drops, they have gotten less each consecutive season. He is a legitimate receiver and can do the fade route just as good as anyone not named Calvin or Andre. The Niners also lost their most productive receiver in Josh Morgan during their 48-3 rout of the Bucs.

I still say you CAN win in this league without airing it out for 300 yards a game. When it comes to scoring, 200 yards with 0 ints is better than 300 yards with 1 int. In most of the games, the Niners played with a lead and they get super conservative when up by 10 points (minus the bucs game, but they got so many turn overs from them inside their own 40, it made scoring easy). They don't shoot themselves in the foot. Might not be flashy, but it's smart. Alex can throw for 300 yards if need be (he has in previous years).

More about Alex.. did you know under Singletary, he would not allow Smith to audible? He was basically hand cuffed last year. Not allowing one of the smarter QB's in the league to audible is probably the most detrimental thing you can do to an offense. He had no trust. So far, this year, Harbaugh has shown trust and Alex's mistakes have been minimal. Less than any other QB.

I know who Delanie Walker is Probably one of the more versitle players in the game becasue someone finally recognized his talents... well let me say he has always had the talent just not in the position to show case it the way he can. Could be his height, honestly I don't really know what it is but he does fly under the radar quite a bit.

I am not saying the other guys can't do things... I am saying that they probably dont do it on the same level. Braylon isnt a blocker like the Steelers WR's are. That comes from Hines who is easily the best down field blocker in WR recent history. braylon just has to step up. He was let go from his other homes because of his hands. He can get out, there is no doubt but who do you trust on a fade route Wallace or Edwards? All I am saying is that Wallace catches just about all of those balls with authority and can run behind anyone in the NFL.

I agree, I think you can win on a solid D and running. Pittsburgh, Baltimore and others have done it for years. Even with an average QB (even though Ben wins, he isn't elite). The only thing those teams struggle with is being able to score when and if you get down. It throws your entire game plan out the window. Patriots made a living doing this to Pittsburgh. If the Niners had a Troy P or an Ed Reed in that secondary I might be a little more inclined to show some love

Singletary was one hell of a player, is probably a great assistant coach, but I think we all know he wasn't ready to be a head coach in the NFL. Love the guy, just went baout things in a wrong way I think.

[np_mach1]

Originally Posted by RobbyB

Every time I watch it, it looks like his right foot is touching his left foot, but his toe is above the ground. I always remind people that pick 6 before the half was what determined the game. That's a 14 point swing that should have never happened, but hey, that's football.

C'mon man. His ankle bends on contact when is feet hit the ground.

There were a couple of big plays in that game for both teams. Little bit of luck and determination and its in the history books as one of the greatest finishes of all time.

[shadowmaker]

Originally Posted by RobbyB

So because they have more catches they are better receivers? Heath Miller is a bum compared to Vernon Davis and Delanie Walker. No one outside of Pittsburg would argue otherwise. The Niners are 32nd in pass attempts. You're going to base talent of the WR off of total yards when they don't get half the opportunities? All I can say is SCOREBOARD because the Niners have scored more than you have. The niners may run the ball a lot, but if you put too many in the box they DO have the wide outs to make you pay for it.

Right, because LINE BACKERS are great at evaluating WR talent. He called him out so there'd be no excuses, not because he's some kind of amazing receiver like Calvin Johnson.

Niners have dealt with injuries on both sides of the ball, but they're still rolling. Every team has injuries.

So let me get this straight. Your team wins 3/4 games without Ben and you want to call him elite because he has two rings? Trent Dilfer has a ring. Big Ben is better than Dilfer, but do you think Big Ben would be as successful with the Colt's defense? Ha. Look how bad that team is without Manning. That's proof he's an elite QB. When your team wins 75% of it's games even without your starting QB, that doesn't help your argument.


I agree with you there. The Saints and Bears are the only teams with a winning record they've played this year. However, no one can even come close to the level of play Rogers is putting up this year. 24 TD's to 3 INT's. That's an 8:1 ratio. Most consider 2:1 good, so he's doing extremely well. The Packers D is really looking suspect though.

No I call him an elite QB bc everyone compares QBs to Brady. Compare the stats Brady vs Ben and see what you got. Compare Bradshaw to Ben and see what you got. Heck, compare him to Joe Montana.

He simply doesnt get the respect he deserves bc the Steelers are hated by everyone, especially the media. Put him in Dallas or NE or NO or Indy and he would be the best thing since sliced bread. Not a QB in the league could do the things hes done or does with the OL hes got. NOBODY. They broke his nose in Baltimore last yr, no flag. They took out Hines this yr, no flag. We re hated, I accept it.... I love it.

The colts have been on a downward spiral for several yrs. It didnt help moral when you bring in not only a RETIRED QB but a so so one at that. Instead of giving your #2 guy a shot. Moral means alot on the field and in a locker room. They pretty much slapped the whole team in the face with that move. With Peyton in his last yrs, is this a plan to pick up Andrew Luck?


For you to even try to down play Hines tells me you are looking at it with blinders. Yeah, Calvin Johnson is better than the future hall of famer.
Hines had already hinted at retirement. If they had won the Superbowl, he was pretty much done. I was shocked after dancing with the stars thing that he came back.

Heath is far from a bum, again take off the blinders. Not only are his stats better but he has 2 Superbowl rings.

They didnt win 75% of the games without Ben, they only played 25% without him.

As far as the feet being down, http://www.steelersdepot.com/2009/02...for-touchdown/ Every picture showing otherwise was after he touched and was hit by Francisco.

http://www.azcentral.com/closeup/art...pholmestd.html Look at 10 his feet are down and the defenders hands are on the bottom of the 10 of his jersey. Pic 11 is the one everyone uses to say he didnt touch but look at the hands, up near the shoulder pads. 12 is different angle, defenders hands down, grass coming off the toes where they touch. That my friend, was a touchdown.

I was at the packers/panthers game. Cam Newton is the real deal. For the Panthers to do what they did, the packers are lucky to get the win. A little better run game and some help on defense, look out. Granted the packers are winning, they are clicking, but as I said, they really havent played anybody.

I have nothing at all against the 49ers. Even pull for em when they play Dallas, NE, Baltimore or Cleveland. Greatest thing going right now for people who hate the cowboys is Jerry Jones. RIP Al Davis but that was the only thing holding the Raiders back for many yrs.

[acreature]

Where in the hell have those Cowboys been? They didn't give the game up in the 4th.

[Big Ron]

Romo = the greatest QB of all time (well for at least one game)!






Big Ron

[02mach1]

Steelers won we are 1/2 game out 1st place

[shadowmaker]

Originally Posted by 02mach1

Steelers won we are 1/2 game out 1st place

Come on Seattle....

[gbranton]

Originally Posted by gbranton

Ok, the NFC North is settled:

(1) Green Bay

(2) Detriot

(3) Chicago




(4) Minnesota

I may need to revise this. Go Bears!

[kiler be]

My Redskins are BACK. We just needed sexy Rexy back at QB.
It was great to see us move the ball down the feild, get in the red zone....and go backwards, kick FG's, or just give the ball back to the other team.
I've been a REDSKIN fan since the 60's but as long as Danny BOY owns the team.........they will always SUCK.

On a positve note. It was nice to take a nap during th 2nd Quarter.

Sorry for the RANT.

[acreature]

Originally Posted by kiler be

My Redskins are BACK.................
Sorry for the RANT.

My Wife is right there with you, ranting.

[RobbyB]

Originally Posted by shadowmaker

No I call him an elite QB bc everyone compares QBs to Brady. Compare the stats Brady vs Ben and see what you got. Compare Bradshaw to Ben and see what you got. Heck, compare him to Joe Montana.

He simply doesnt get the respect he deserves bc the Steelers are hated by everyone, especially the media. Put him in Dallas or NE or NO or Indy and he would be the best thing since sliced bread. Not a QB in the league could do the things hes done or does with the OL hes got. NOBODY. They broke his nose in Baltimore last yr, no flag. They took out Hines this yr, no flag. We re hated, I accept it.... I love it.

The colts have been on a downward spiral for several yrs. It didnt help moral when you bring in not only a RETIRED QB but a so so one at that. Instead of giving your #2 guy a shot. Moral means alot on the field and in a locker room. They pretty much slapped the whole team in the face with that move. With Peyton in his last yrs, is this a plan to pick up Andrew Luck?


For you to even try to down play Hines tells me you are looking at it with blinders. Yeah, Calvin Johnson is better than the future hall of famer.
Hines had already hinted at retirement. If they had won the Superbowl, he was pretty much done. I was shocked after dancing with the stars thing that he came back.

Heath is far from a bum, again take off the blinders. Not only are his stats better but he has 2 Superbowl rings.

They didnt win 75% of the games without Ben, they only played 25% without him.

As far as the feet being down, http://www.steelersdepot.com/2009/02...for-touchdown/ Every picture showing otherwise was after he touched and was hit by Francisco.

http://www.azcentral.com/closeup/art...pholmestd.html Look at 10 his feet are down and the defenders hands are on the bottom of the 10 of his jersey. Pic 11 is the one everyone uses to say he didnt touch but look at the hands, up near the shoulder pads. 12 is different angle, defenders hands down, grass coming off the toes where they touch. That my friend, was a touchdown.

I was at the packers/panthers game. Cam Newton is the real deal. For the Panthers to do what they did, the packers are lucky to get the win. A little better run game and some help on defense, look out. Granted the packers are winning, they are clicking, but as I said, they really havent played anybody.

I have nothing at all against the 49ers. Even pull for em when they play Dallas, NE, Baltimore or Cleveland. Greatest thing going right now for people who hate the cowboys is Jerry Jones. RIP Al Davis but that was the only thing holding the Raiders back for many yrs.

I'll give you the Holmes catch. I hadn't seen those pictures.

But Hines Ward... yes, he has had a HOF career, but even Jerry Rice's production declined in his mid 30's. Hines Ward is not what he used to be. If this was 2005, you'd have a strong case for Hines being elite, but I don't think anyone considers him that anymore. Calvin Johnson is a better WR in 2011. Unfortunately for Detroit, he's all they got and defenses are starting to figure that out.


I've had the same argument with Packers fans. Outside of New Orleans in week 1 (that could have gone to either team the way the game was going), they have beat no one. I think the Bears might upset them.

Also, please don't blaspheme Joe Montana's name with Brady or Big Ben. Regular season stats notwithstanding, Montana never threw a single interception in a super bowl and routed Elway 55-10. He dominated big games, while Big Ben was inconsistent at best.

[02mach1]

Steelers are in 1st place

[RobbyB]

Originally Posted by 02mach1

Steelers are in 1st place

2nd Seed, tied for 3rd best record. Losing to the Texans will hurt you come playoff time. They are in good position to get #1 seed unless Baltimore wins your division, then they have the tie breaker over Houston.

[shadowmaker]

Originally Posted by RobbyB

2nd Seed, tied for 3rd best record. Losing to the Texans will hurt you come playoff time. They are in good position to get #1 seed unless Baltimore wins your division, then they have the tie breaker over Houston.

Why would Houston hurt us? They lost to Tennessee and Jacksonville.

Dont know where I want them to be. #1 is nice but I m scared they ll get lazy with the 1st round bye.

You can say what you want but all the fines against our defense has affected their play. They dont know how to hit anymore. I wish the Rooneys would just call em all together and go "F the commissioner and his definition of a hitting. Get out there and play football, I got your fines coverd." Heck, the refees dont even know what to call.

[RobbyB]

Originally Posted by shadowmaker

Why would Houston hurt us? They lost to Tennessee and Jacksonville.

Dont know where I want them to be. #1 is nice but I m scared they ll get lazy with the 1st round bye.

You can say what you want but all the fines against our defense has affected their play. They dont know how to hit anymore. I wish the Rooneys would just call em all together and go "F the commissioner and his definition of a hitting. Get out there and play football, I got your fines coverd." Heck, the refees dont even know what to call.

Houston lost to Baltimore, Oakland and New Orleans. I meant if you end up with the same record as Houston, they get a higher seed than you due to heads up tie breaker. Baltimore doesn't matter who they lose to now... if they end up with the same record as you, Baltimore sweeped you so they get the tie breaker. My point was that the teams with records high enough to compete for a seed, you have lost to with the exception of cinci.

[kiler be]

Originally Posted by acreature

My Wife is right there with you, ranting.

Tell her she is not alone and I feel her pain.

[gbranton]

Hey Merril Hodge, how about Tim Tebow now?

I've never seen a GM look like somebody peed in his cornflakes when his team goes ahead with :58 to go util I saw John Elway just now. Elway sits in the owner's booth HATING every minute of this, looking like the woman who owned the Indians in Major League. Denver has done EVERYTHING HUMANLY POSSIBLE to sabatoge Tim Tebow (which should be grounds for firing them all) and he continues to win games for them. Just imagine what he could do with a coach/GM/supporting cast who supported him.

[Thunderbolt]

Jets! Jets! Jets! Crash! Crash! Crash!

[Thunderbolt]

Originally Posted by gbranton

Hey Merril Hodge, how about Tim Tebow now?

I've never seen a GM look like somebody peed in his cornflakes when his team goes ahead with :58 to go util I saw John Elway just now. Elway sits in the owner's booth HATING every minute of this, looking like the woman who owned the Indians in Major League. Denver has done EVERYTHING HUMANLY POSSIBLE to sabatoge Tim Tebow (which should be grounds for firing them all) and he continues to win games for them. Just imagine what he could do with a coach/GM/supporting cast who supported him.

I don't know anything about the drama within the Broncos, but I like Tebow. The guy has the look in his eyes of a guy that's driven and wants to win. I told a co-worker before the season even started they should start Tebow from game 1. He's squirrely and winning games which is good to see, but I doubt that kind of play would cut it in the Playoffs. I think they'd get killed. He needs to find at least a small comfort zone in the pocket.

[gbranton]

Originally Posted by Thunderbolt

I doubt that kind of play would cut it in the Playoffs. I think they'd get killed. He needs to find at least a small comfort zone in the pocket.

I'm not saying he doesn't need to improve, but I think he has some intangible greatness about him and instead of doing things like trading away the best reciever on the team and saying things like "If he tried to run a conventional offense he'd be screwed" that the Broncos should support him. All he has done is WIN with NOTHING around him except a good defense.

[np_mach1]

Originally Posted by gbranton

Hey Merril Hodge, how about Tim Tebow now?

I've never seen a GM look like somebody peed in his cornflakes when his team goes ahead with :58 to go util I saw John Elway just now. Elway sits in the owner's booth HATING every minute of this, looking like the woman who owned the Indians in Major League. Denver has done EVERYTHING HUMANLY POSSIBLE to sabatoge Tim Tebow (which should be grounds for firing them all) and he continues to win games for them. Just imagine what he could do with a coach/GM/supporting cast who supported him.

I thought I was the only one who felt this way. They trade the best WR on the team away. They suffocate his ability with poor play calling (like going away from the spread to a conventional style O against the Lions), they still dont call the right plays for him or allow him to grow as a QB but **** it... I love the fact that he never gives up and just wins. Elway looked soooo pissed last night and I was shocked to see his face. Made me want to shake him and say Hey! Your team is going to WIN!!

Not saying we should look up to athletes as role models (since I believe that is the job of the parent to be one) but, I would be proud if my kids wanted to be like Tim Tebow when they grew up.

[gbranton]

Originally Posted by np_mach1

They suffocate his ability with poor play calling (like going away from the spread to a conventional style O against the Lions), they still dont call the right plays for him or allow him to grow as a QB but **** it... I love the fact that he never gives up and just wins.

Elway looked soooo pissed last night and I was shocked to see his face. Made me want to shake him and say Hey! Your team is going to WIN!!

Not saying we should look up to athletes as role models (since I believe that is the job of the parent to be one) but, I would be proud if my kids wanted to be like Tim Tebow when they grew up.

Yeah like going for it on fourth down on the twenty yard line instead of kicking a FG against one of the supposed top defenses in the NFL when you KNOW it's going to be a low scoring game.

Elway is pissed, him and Fox got tired of the fans asking for Tebow so they put him out there........to fail. They only wanted to shut everyone up and it hasn't gone exactly like they anticipated, even though they undermine him at every turn. Imagine Tebow on a team with a coaching staff like the Patriots or the Steelers that makes the MOST of every player on the field and whose main focus is winning, not getting into the Andrew Luck sweepstakes.

As for the role model comments AGREED and AGREED.

[kiler be]

Elway was and still is a PUNK.
Denver could still get A. Luck........If Tebow keeps winning they could trade him for the #1 over all pick. lol