2003-04 Mach 1 Registry Owners Club  


Go Back   2003-04 Mach 1 Registry Owners Club > "GO" Discussions > Engine & Drivetrain (Including trans & rear axles)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-14-2005, 05:16 PM   #26
Ralph Greene
Registered User
 
Ralph Greene's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Longwood Fl
Posts: 3,724
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

Quote:
Originally Posted by mach1dsg
ralph, why do you think 3.73's would be better for all around use over 3.55's??, i know 4.10's or 4.30's would be the ticket for drag racing,but i haven't think about 3.73's as a replacement for the stock 3.55's until know. i know anything over 4.10s would improve acceleration in the 1/4 mile, but traction would be become an issue with street tires, specially with the ones that i was thinking to install (4.30s), i also know, dr's would cure the traction problem, but i drive 120miles every day, so i can't not afford to replace dr's every 2 months, plus i need to be able to drive in the rain.
Well....This is how I look at it. For casual drag racing at the strip, with maybe Nitto DR's, 3.55's work pretty good. To retain stock cruising drivability, set of cheap rear 17X8 wheels with Nitto DR's cost about same as gear change. Our 3.38 first gear with a 3.55 rear gear gives a fairly low overall ratio for first gear (3.38X3.55=12-1). That ratio is lower than an 03/04 Cobra with 4.30's and 2.66 first (11.44-1). Work on getting 60' down to about 1.8 or so. You can run it out in 3rd. Cars have gone high 12's with this combo and stock power. Most cars on this forum with every bolt on mod available, 4.10's (manuals) and such, on stock type tires, don't run 12's.

For much more serious drag racing with sticky tires (BFG DR's or better) on race wheels, I would run 4.30's, and learn to launch off or near the rev limiter. But purchase race wheels. This is the hot ticket, if you wish to make your car into a race oriented car. You must get your 60' in the 1.5-1.6 area. It's all about 60' times, more so than HP. This kind of abuse requires some serious mods to drivetrain.

For cars not set up to race at the strip (been lowered etc), but where you just want a little more mechanical advantage for street acceleration, then run 3.73's, 3.90's, or 4.10's, depending on your tires and how much 4th gear speed you wish to give up, and how many extra RPM's you're willing to put up with while cruising. But these gears require an extra shift at the strip VS 3.55's, offsetting some of their advantage.

Forget what top speed could be in 5th. If you have to shift to 5th in any kind of encounter, it's all over with our extremely tall .62 5th. 5th just for cruising. We really just have a 4 speed car (manuals) plus tall overdrive.
__________________
Ralph Greene
SOLD
03 Mach 1 (Torch Red) 5 Speed Manual
Real Ford FR 500 18X9 Wheels
255X40X18 Michelin Tires
Steeda Sport Springs (isolators in)
Tokico HP Struts/Shocks
Steeda 4 bolt CC Plates
Poly Offset Steering Rack Bushings
Steeda TriAx Shifter
Magnaflow X/Cats
Bassani Catback with Removable Baffles

Last edited by Ralph Greene; 01-15-2005 at 11:45 AM.
Ralph Greene is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2005, 05:23 PM   #27
downsouthman1
Registered User
 
downsouthman1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Killeen, TX
Posts: 394
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Greene
Well....This is how I look at it. For casual drag racing at the strip, with maybe Nitto DR's, 3.55's work pretty good. To retain stock cruising drivability, set of cheap rear 17X8 wheels with Nitto DR's cost about same as gear change. Our 3.38 first gear with a 3.55 rear gear gives a fairly low overall ratio for first gear (3.38X3.55=12-1). That ratio is lower than an 03/04 Cobra with 4.30's and 2.66 first (11.44-1). Work on getting 60' down to about 1.8 or so. You can run it out in 3rd. Cars have gone high 12's with this combo and stock power. Most cars on this forum with every bolt on mod available, 4.10's (manuals) and such, on stock type tires, don't run 12's.

For much more serious drag racing with sticky tires (BFG DR's or better) on race wheels, I would run 4.30's, and learn to launch off or near the rev limiter. But purchase race wheels. This is the hot ticket, if you wish to make your car into a race oriented car. You must get your 60' in the 1.5-1.6 area. It's all about 60' times, more so than HP. This kind of abuse requires some serious mods to drivetrain.

For cars not set up to race at the strip (been lowered etc), but where you just want a little more mechanical advantage for street acceleration, then run 3.73's, 3.90's, or 4.10's, depending on your tires and how much 4th gear speed you wish to give up, and how many extra RPM's you're willing to put up with while cruising. But these gears require an extra shift at the strip VS 3.55's, offsetting some of their advantage.

Forget what top speed could be in 5th. If you have to shift to 5th in any kind of encounter, it's all over with our extremely tall .62 5th. 5th just for cruising. We really just have a 4 speed car (manuals) plus tall overdrive.
Speaking along these lines I can actually shift into 5th @ 35MPH w/ the 4.30s. To be funny last night, I shifted into each gear @ 2KRPMs. It was almost impossible to shift 1st fast enough to keep it under 2000. 2nd was almost as challenging. Once I got into 4th I was allowed to accelerate to just under 50 before needing to shift to 5th @ 2000RPMs. Just though this was interesting.
__________________
2K4 White Mach 1 M5 DiabloSport Flash Dynotuned: 11-02-2005 w/ 338RWHP & 359RWTQ. Best run: 13.5@105.1 before 315s, C&L, & tune. Has: 40-Series 2-Chamber Flows; 85 mm C&L MAF; AFS 17X9 & 17X10.5 Mach Rims; BBK Long Tubes & O/R X; Baer D/S/Z Rotors, Grand-Tour 2-pist Calipers, & SS Lines; Custom Full Subframes; FRPP 4.30s, 31-splines, & Lim Slip Diff; H&R SS Springs; HPM D/S Loop; Nitto DR 315s;MM Bumpstop; Offset Rack Bushings; MILs; SVO Girdle.
Pics: http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2071960
downsouthman1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2005, 10:13 AM   #28
Keith.red.mach1
Registered User
 
Keith.red.mach1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: League City, TX
Posts: 922
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

What performance gain would our cars see if adding 4.10 gears in say a 60 roll race on the freeway?

Unfortunately most of my races happen when I am commuting. I know people talk about how strong the LS1 cars are up top, but I have an amazing record against those even past 100 mph races. I don't know if the chip helped in this area that much.

I used to have 4.10s in my 97 Cobra, I know it helped when 1/4 dragging but wasn't sure if the affect was as great on 60 punch races.
Keith.red.mach1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2005, 11:54 AM   #29
WhiteTXMach
300+ N/A rwhp Club
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Austin TX
Posts: 642
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

There sure is A LOT of extemely valuable information in this thread. Thanks to all who posted their input, whether it be simply mathmatical, or from previous race experience.
__________________
DOB 06-18-03
1 of 814 Oxford White 03's
312 rwhp/ 328 rwtq SAE (motor)
459 rwhp/ 597 rwtq (N20)
WhiteTXMach is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2005, 08:17 PM   #30
Voodoo96743
Registered User
 
Voodoo96743's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: FT Collins, CO/ Big Island, HI
Posts: 317
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

If this is to become the official gears sticky, may I suggest adding info about what degree of rebuild kits would be needed at various mileage, what misc parts are needed (I recall some sort of special pin or grinding needed with 4.56+), etc.
__________________
'04 Azure Blue, 5spd, IUP: built 10/13/03
Voodoo96743 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2005, 05:12 PM   #31
Fosters
LS1-stock
 
Fosters's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Chandler, AZ
Posts: 1,550
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

Quote:
Originally Posted by Voodoo96743
If this is to become the official gears sticky, may I suggest adding info about what degree of rebuild kits would be needed at various mileage, what misc parts are needed (I recall some sort of special pin or grinding needed with 4.56+), etc.
with 31 spline differentials, you get a thicker cross pin; and also, with steeper gears, the ring gear will be thicker, to the point the teeth of the gear will cover up some of the real estate needed to put in/take out the cross pin. I don't believe all 31 spline differentials offer similar thickness pins, so you might be able to slide by with some.

The Ford 31 spline traklok needs to have the pin ground to be able to fit 4.30s or higher on there. I believe same is the case with the Torsen differentials. Not sure about the eaton or auburn ones.
__________________
2013 gt - TBD
2004 mach1 - 12.31@110.17, 1.645 60' - SOLD
Fosters is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-25-2005, 12:59 PM   #32
stangedyou
Guest
 
stangedyou's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: morton, illinois
Posts: 23
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

I Need Some Advice About What Gears To Get. I Have A 02 Gt 5spd And I Am Looking Into Getting Some Gears Soon, What Should I Get?
stangedyou is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2005, 06:56 PM   #33
machiado
adrenaline junkie
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Austin
Posts: 18
Wink Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

"This IS a tasty burger".... Thanks for all the info, in this thread... I just took the 4:30s out of my car, in favor of the 3:55s. I think every owner has to analyze their individual use, and gear-up/down accordingly. The fuel economy with the 4:30s sucked. I hope to see better economy when I can keep my foot out of it...
machiado is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2005, 04:24 PM   #34
Fenixfire
Its stock....No really!
 
Fenixfire's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Posts: 4,433
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

I dont care much about top speed, I just want acceleration, but I heard having the lower gears like 4.10 or 4.30 are harder on the engine. Is this true? Plus I would like to have reasonable gas mileage still so I was thinking maybe 3.73s would be the best gears for me, or should i stay stock?
Fenixfire is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-14-2005, 08:26 PM   #35
03mach91lx
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Baltimore,MD
Posts: 75
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

Im either going 3.73's or 4.10's I just wanted to know if I switch to 4.10's how bad of a spinning problem am I gonna have ?. I mean right now im street tires I had the et streets on the car but they didn't last to long
03mach91lx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2005, 12:57 AM   #36
New Mach
Team Comp Orange Pres.
 
New Mach's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Silicon Valley
Posts: 927
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

Quote:
Originally Posted by grimreefer
Got bored

Are the Mach1 4R70W ratios as follows???:
2.84
1.55
1.00
0.70 (OD)


Manual
.62 ratio, 80mph, at X.XX:1 rear gear ratio

3.55 = 2304 rpm
3.73 = 2421 rpm
4.10 = 2661 rpm
4.30 = 2791 rpm
4.56 = 2960 rpm

top speed w/ 3.55s, 5th gear @ 6798 rpm = 236 mph
top speed w/ 3.73s, 5th gear @ 6780 rpm = 224 mph
top speed w/ 4.10s, 5th gear @ 6787 rpm = 204 mph
top speed w/ 4.30s, 5th gear @ 6769 rpm = 194 mph
top speed w/ 4.56s, 5th gear @ 6771 rpm = 183 mph

Auto
.70 ratio, 80mph, at X.XX:1 rear gear ratio

3.55 = 2602 rpm
3.73 = 2733 rpm
4.10 = 3005 rpm
4.30 = 3151 rpm
4.56 = 3342 rpm

top speed w/ 3.55, @ 5789 rpm = 178 mph
top speed w/ 3.73, @ 5775 rpm = 169 mph
top speed w/ 4.10, @ 5784 rpm = 154 mph
top speed w/ 4.30, @ 5791 rpm = 147 mph
top speed w/ 4.56, @ 5765 rpm = 138 mph
If I'm reading this correctly, would 4.10's in an auto tranmission be roughly equal to 4.56's in an manual transmission? Or am I backwards?

Michael
__________________
2004 Comp. Orange Mach 1/AUTO

Performance:
K&N Filter
Magnaflow X-Pipe
Magnaflow Cat-Back
Predator Diablo Tune
Suspension:
Griggs Rear Springs/300 lbs.
Koni Yellow Adjustable
MM CC Plates
MM Front Coilovers
MM Adjustable Rear LCA
MM Full length SFC
MM 4-pt K-Member Brace
MM Steel Braided Brake Lines
Appearance:
35W DDM HID Lights
S281 Rear Deck Spoiler
MRT 3" Rolled Exhaust Tips
Ford 8.8 Axle Cover
Saleen Matt Black 18x9
Nitto Extreme 555 275/35/18

*SOLD 2017*
New Mach is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-24-2005, 07:00 PM   #37
Ranger Bob
Registered User
 
Ranger Bob's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Fayetteville, NC
Posts: 17
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

right now im thinking about getting 3.90 or 4.10 gears but its my every days driver. if i have a k&n cai, bbk long tube headers,slp loundmouth cat backs, diablo preditor tune and put one of these 2 gears on will i be having trouble with spinning the tires off of every take off? my car is loud as hell with my slp loudmoths and cops love to mess with me now, so im just trying to see if ill have to baby my take offs as to not get more cops to pull me over for something.
__________________
MODS:
K&N Cold Air Intake
BBK Full Length Headers
SLP Loudmouth Exhaust
and more to come.....
Ranger Bob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-24-2005, 11:44 PM   #38
New Mach
Team Comp Orange Pres.
 
New Mach's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Silicon Valley
Posts: 927
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

You'll spin only if you peform sprited take offs, so don't let that hold you back. As fars as the gears, again that depends on your transmission, remember 410's in a auto is like having 456's in manual. If your car is a 5 speed, you'll love the 410,'s. If your an auto go with the 390's.

Michael
__________________
2004 Comp. Orange Mach 1/AUTO

Performance:
K&N Filter
Magnaflow X-Pipe
Magnaflow Cat-Back
Predator Diablo Tune
Suspension:
Griggs Rear Springs/300 lbs.
Koni Yellow Adjustable
MM CC Plates
MM Front Coilovers
MM Adjustable Rear LCA
MM Full length SFC
MM 4-pt K-Member Brace
MM Steel Braided Brake Lines
Appearance:
35W DDM HID Lights
S281 Rear Deck Spoiler
MRT 3" Rolled Exhaust Tips
Ford 8.8 Axle Cover
Saleen Matt Black 18x9
Nitto Extreme 555 275/35/18

*SOLD 2017*
New Mach is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-27-2005, 05:57 PM   #39
Ranger Bob
Registered User
 
Ranger Bob's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Fayetteville, NC
Posts: 17
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vffr1
You'll spin only if you peform sprited take offs, so don't let that hold you back. As fars as the gears, again that depends on your transmission, remember 410's in a auto is like having 456's in manual. If your car is a 5 speed, you'll love the 410,'s. If your an auto go with the 390's.

Michael
thanks for the information. if i take my car to the track on occasion would i have any troubles with the stock rear axle with 4.10 gears in a manual? should i get 28 or 31 spline axles or am i good with as little upgrades that i have.
__________________
MODS:
K&N Cold Air Intake
BBK Full Length Headers
SLP Loudmouth Exhaust
and more to come.....
Ranger Bob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-27-2005, 07:39 PM   #40
New Mach
Team Comp Orange Pres.
 
New Mach's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Silicon Valley
Posts: 927
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

If you plan on doing lots or 1/4 miles stuff the safe bet is to go with 31 spline axles.

JMO

Michael
__________________
2004 Comp. Orange Mach 1/AUTO

Performance:
K&N Filter
Magnaflow X-Pipe
Magnaflow Cat-Back
Predator Diablo Tune
Suspension:
Griggs Rear Springs/300 lbs.
Koni Yellow Adjustable
MM CC Plates
MM Front Coilovers
MM Adjustable Rear LCA
MM Full length SFC
MM 4-pt K-Member Brace
MM Steel Braided Brake Lines
Appearance:
35W DDM HID Lights
S281 Rear Deck Spoiler
MRT 3" Rolled Exhaust Tips
Ford 8.8 Axle Cover
Saleen Matt Black 18x9
Nitto Extreme 555 275/35/18

*SOLD 2017*
New Mach is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2005, 06:50 PM   #41
Ranger Bob
Registered User
 
Ranger Bob's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Fayetteville, NC
Posts: 17
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vffr1
If you plan on doing lots or 1/4 miles stuff the safe bet is to go with 31 spline axles.

JMO

Michael
thank you for your help
__________________
MODS:
K&N Cold Air Intake
BBK Full Length Headers
SLP Loudmouth Exhaust
and more to come.....
Ranger Bob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2005, 02:05 PM   #42
jdoug
Regular Guy
 
jdoug's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: SoFla
Posts: 329
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

Does anybody know anything about these guys?

Pro50 Gears
__________________
J Doug
jdoug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2005, 06:27 PM   #43
mach1dsg
Cam only LS2 Powered
 
mach1dsg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Holland,OH
Posts: 1,463
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

you guys can see the difference in max speed (MPH) in every gear with different final drive ratios. i used 6800rpm as max rpm in any gear.
Attached Thumbnails
gearing_diff.jpg  
__________________
2006 Impulse Blue Metallic GTO M6
12.15@114.09mph, 1.85 60'

2003 Mustang Mach 1 DSG 5 speed -SOLD-
13.43@104.3mph, 2.01 60'
mach1dsg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2006, 03:47 PM   #44
playtime_04
Guest
 
playtime_04's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 362
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

I still dont know if i should go with 4.10s or 3.90s? i have a manual.
playtime_04 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2006, 04:23 PM   #45
YellowMenace
Registered User
 
YellowMenace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Schertz, TX
Posts: 2,639
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

Quote:
Originally Posted by playtime_04
I still dont know if i should go with 4.10s or 3.90s? i have a manual.
If you had an auto I'd say 4.10s...with a manual, I'd say 4.10s aren't enough. go with 4.30s
__________________
Zinc yellow NMRA Factory Stock configuration Coyote 5.0 engine, FRPP Control Pack and a bunch of other stuff. Best ET in this configuration 10.693@123
YellowMenace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2006, 06:30 PM   #46
2003MachI
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Houston
Posts: 332
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

I am not sure if this question is answered yet and I thought I have seen it before... can't seem to find it right now. I have a blown auto mach with stock gears. Which gears would be the best for me? I do a ton of driving and see some track. How well do you guys think the car will hook up on the street with 285 drag nittos with the gears? I don't have the 285s on the car yet and I have 245s that spin like crazy with the blower. I cruise at 120 a lot right now and race til 150 or so usually; but I guess I can let the high MPH go for some quickness.
2003MachI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2006, 09:37 AM   #47
Keith.red.mach1
Registered User
 
Keith.red.mach1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: League City, TX
Posts: 922
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

I see that you are in Houston. I have 2 sets of Nitto Drags 275/40 17 and 305/35/18s. If you want to meet up one day we can mount a set and take it for a drive. I would like to feel that blown Mach so I would be happy to see what you think of the bigger drag radials.

Keith
Keith.red.mach1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2006, 03:50 PM   #48
2003MachI
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Houston
Posts: 332
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

You wanna sell the 275s? I live in Tomball, we go out everyday Tuesday to a Lowes off 249, tons of cars go out there and we do some street racing. I also go out to 1960 an 45 to sonic every friday night. If you ever go I have a red mach 1 with black fr500s with a BLOWN emblem on the back.
2003MachI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2006, 07:27 PM   #49
YellowMenace
Registered User
 
YellowMenace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Schertz, TX
Posts: 2,639
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2003MachI
You wanna sell the 275s? I live in Tomball, we go out everyday Tuesday to a Lowes off 249, tons of cars go out there and we do some street racing. I also go out to 1960 an 45 to sonic every friday night. If you ever go I have a red mach 1 with black fr500s with a BLOWN emblem on the back.
Street racing ain't too smart but posting when and where on the Internet is even worse.
__________________
Zinc yellow NMRA Factory Stock configuration Coyote 5.0 engine, FRPP Control Pack and a bunch of other stuff. Best ET in this configuration 10.693@123
YellowMenace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2006, 07:14 PM   #50
2003MachI
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Houston
Posts: 332
Re: Gears - to answer the questions once and for all

We don't race there...usually go up there just to talk and sit around. People drive 30 miles away to go race if they want to.
2003MachI is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:23 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
(c) 2002-2013 Mach1Registry.com

<