lost oil pressure - 2003-04 Mach 1 Registry Owners Club

DSG2003Mach1 · 02-07-2015, 10:13 PM

confirmed via mechanical gauge, absolutely zero oil pressure. Im going to guess the oil pump gears.

That will make 3 procharged cars with Innovators West crank pulleys that shattered the stock oil pump gears that I know of on this board. I never once hit the limiter so there goes my theory on that one

bris09 · 02-07-2015, 11:40 PM

Sorry to hear that.

I've always felt it has more to do with the sudden acceleration and deceleration of the engine that beats the gears to death. I base this theory on the wear marks that are on both sides of the gears.

machgsxr · 02-08-2015, 12:02 AM

That sucks. Sorry to hear that. Didn't you just get it running too? Hopefully the damage isn't too bad.

mach1z · 02-08-2015, 08:22 AM

IW is a solid piece correct?

DSG2003Mach1 · 02-08-2015, 08:49 AM

Ya, it hasn't been running that long because it kept going down for minor upgrades and tweaks.

I don't remember if the IW piece is just solid or not

Mach828 · 02-08-2015, 09:04 AM

**** that is rough. Sorry to hear.

DSG2003Mach1 · 02-08-2015, 09:30 AM

Ya, not gonna lie, definitely feeling pretty down about it

not a gt · 02-08-2015, 10:12 AM

Man sorry to hear this, I know you were just doing the oil sender..hopefully all is well inside... what was the circumstances when it went to zero?? Idling in garage, driving??

Zack · 02-08-2015, 10:13 AM

Curious to hear your thoughts on how the balancer can break the gears.

Sorry to hear bud

DSG2003Mach1 · 02-08-2015, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by not a gt

Man sorry to hear this, I know you were just doing the oil sender..hopefully all is well inside... what was the circumstances when it went to zero?? Idling in garage, driving??

the factory gauge had been on the fritz, it would bounce back and forth between normal and 0 on a pretty regular interval so I think the sender was on its way out anyway. I had some noises from the old thump tensioner rubbing the timing cover again and the leaky header gasket so its hard to pinpoint really. The only time it as making any noise was just idling in the garage so hopefully its minimal.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zack

Curious to hear your thoughts on how the balancer can break the gears.

Sorry to hear bud

these motors are internally balanced, the crank pulley is just a dampner. My thought based on the other 2 cars that I knew of was that hitting the rev limiter was causing them to fail. I dont know for sure that nekasrof or his wife hit the limiter but I know the guy with the Orange mach hit it quite a few times thanks to the tune in his auto car.

At this point I dont know if theres some kind of vibration the IW piece just doesnt dampen properly and it wipes out the gears or the fact that all of us were well over 600 at the wheels

mach1z · 02-08-2015, 12:05 PM

Makes sense to me, you are eliminating a forgiving rubber damper with a solid piece.

DSG2003Mach1 · 02-08-2015, 01:03 PM

from the IW website, its not just a solid piece

Inside the light weight billet aluminum cover is a free floating wet friction clutch pack assembly that utilizes spring loaded inertia rings to dampen crankshaft harmonics over a wide RPM range. The rings work in conjunction with clutches to provide outstanding dampening action. That action does generate some heat, and we use a small amount of fluid inside that acts as a lubricant as well as dissipates heat to the outer body.

mach1z · 02-08-2015, 02:25 PM

Disregard then. I thought they were just machined parts.
I would still try an ATI next if I was you, granted if moneys are there.

DSG2003Mach1 · 02-08-2015, 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mach1z

Disregard then. I thought they were just machined parts.
I would still try an ATI next if I was you, granted if moneys are there.

I have not seen any failures anywhere when upgrading to the billet gears but I will be looking into it. I will probably move to a 10% OD crank pulley and go ahead and spin the D1 close to its red line.

rugs04mach · 02-08-2015, 03:48 PM

I'm worried as well. Does it make sense to pull the motor apart and replace the gears proactively? What kind of job/labor is it? Easier to do with motor out of car?

DSG2003Mach1 · 02-09-2015, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rugs04mach

I'm worried as well. Does it make sense to pull the motor apart and replace the gears proactively? What kind of job/labor is it? Easier to do with motor out of car?

if I could back I would...a set of gears from someone like TSS is around $400. Youd be in it for the gears + crank pulley bolt + timing cover gasket and if theres any seals on the pump.

definitely easier out of the car but very doable in the car. valve covers need to be loosened up, oil pan bolts to the timing cover take out, power steering pump removed and the crank pulley removed. Removing the crank pulley usually means unbolting the expansion tank and moving it to the side (dont have to drain it) and removing the cooling fan (you CAN get it out, just be careful) to fit the pulley pulley on there.

once you get the timing cover off you need to mark all you timing chains appropriately and remove them. The timing gears come off then its supposedly super easy to yank the pump, switch the gears and pack em with assembly lube then put it all back.

Its a lot of stuff to do but looks like none of it is incredibly difficult. If you pay a shop youre looking at 800-1000bucks + parts. Doing it yourself even with a new pump youd be at under $600 with gaskets and rtv...Now if Im the luckiest man alive Ill be out $600 but likely quite a bit more up to a whole damned new motor

Vndcatr · 02-09-2015, 03:56 PM

**** man , that sucks to hear..What pump and gears did you go with ? Ive always had great luck with termys and twin screws on stock pumps..

It is hard to pinpoint things like this when nothing is stock anymore haha.. Hope it works out and no damage was done..

DSG2003Mach1 · 02-09-2015, 04:30 PM

not sure what Im gonna do but leaning towards a TSS matched set of billet gears and pump

311-420 · 02-09-2015, 05:12 PM

Sorry to hear this dude. As you know, you're not even close to being the first to break those gears making that kind of power. Don't sweat it too much though. Everything balances.

TKat13 · 02-09-2015, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rugs04mach

I'm worried as well. Does it make sense to pull the motor apart and replace the gears proactively? What kind of job/labor is it? Easier to do with motor out of car?

If you plan on making that much power, I would proactively put upgraded oil pump gears in it, I know I did.

DSG2003Mach1,
Sorry to hear the bad news, I know exactly how you feel and it is no picnic. I took a few months away from the car when mine died, needed to regain my composure. Starting back on mine this week, unless I get that instant anger feeling when I walk into the garage and look at her.

01yellerCobra · 02-09-2015, 07:19 PM

That's why I went with the Melling when I built my engine. I've bwen running the ATI 12% overdrive with no issues. If you're looking for a crank pulley let me know. I don't need my ATI anymore and am looking to sell it.

DSG2003Mach1 · 02-09-2015, 08:01 PM

If it's an 8 rib shoot me a pride and I'll look into it...I think I can get away with that without really over spinning the blower... Was thinking at least a 10% over drive while this is going on.... Come back stronger than before

SuperMach1 · 02-10-2015, 10:29 PM

D@mn man that really sucks @ss!!! Im procharged with the IW Overdrive balancer. I did go with MMR pump and billet gears, hopefully it works out. I would go with TSS also I've read only good things about them.

4vlover · 02-12-2015, 05:29 AM

is it at 0 always?

if its only under heavy throttle your pickup tube could be gunked up. I'm sure you know that though

DSG2003Mach1 · 02-12-2015, 08:06 AM

It was zero on the mechanical gauge at idle

02-07-2015, 10:13 PM	#1
DSG2003Mach1 700 HP Mach Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 8,384	lost oil pressure confirmed via mechanical gauge, absolutely zero oil pressure. Im going to guess the oil pump gears. That will make 3 procharged cars with Innovators West crank pulleys that shattered the stock oil pump gears that I know of on this board. I never once hit the limiter so there goes my theory on that one __________________ 03 dsg mach1 - MPR built 9.5:1 motor, D1, cams, ported intake, full exhaust, magnum t56, built rear, E85 etc... '12 F150 FX2 Supercrew with Ecoboost daily beater

02-07-2015, 11:40 PM	#2
bris09 Registered User Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Middletown, PA Posts: 3,991	Re: lost oil pressure Sorry to hear that. I've always felt it has more to do with the sudden acceleration and deceleration of the engine that beats the gears to death. I base this theory on the wear marks that are on both sides of the gears. __________________ Brian 04 Azure Mach 1 Mods: Enough to not be the slowest, but nowhere near enough to be the fastest. 17 Fusion Sport Now faster than the Mach 96 Laser Red Cobra Vert For those days you just wanna cruise with the top down 89 Shelby CSX Still rocking the VNT and Fiberides.

02-08-2015, 12:02 AM	#3
machgsxr Registered User Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: San Antonio Posts: 6,414	Re: lost oil pressure That sucks. Sorry to hear that. Didn't you just get it running too? Hopefully the damage isn't too bad.

02-08-2015, 08:22 AM	#4
mach1z Registered User Join Date: May 2005 Location: Woodstock,GA Posts: 544	Re: lost oil pressure IW is a solid piece correct? __________________ I/E, 4:10's, tune

02-08-2015, 08:49 AM	#5
DSG2003Mach1 700 HP Mach Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 8,384	Re: lost oil pressure Ya, it hasn't been running that long because it kept going down for minor upgrades and tweaks. I don't remember if the IW piece is just solid or not __________________ 03 dsg mach1 - MPR built 9.5:1 motor, D1, cams, ported intake, full exhaust, magnum t56, built rear, E85 etc... '12 F150 FX2 Supercrew with Ecoboost daily beater

02-08-2015, 09:04 AM	#6
Mach828 Dark Knight Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Albuquerque, NM Posts: 5,759	**** that is rough. Sorry to hear. __________________ Vortech V2 S-trim, E85, A2A Treadstone, Comp cams, built engine, full exhaust, built rear, built 4r70, more mods. Tuned by me with SCT Advantage

02-08-2015, 09:30 AM	#7
DSG2003Mach1 700 HP Mach Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 8,384	Re: lost oil pressure Ya, not gonna lie, definitely feeling pretty down about it __________________ 03 dsg mach1 - MPR built 9.5:1 motor, D1, cams, ported intake, full exhaust, magnum t56, built rear, E85 etc... '12 F150 FX2 Supercrew with Ecoboost daily beater

02-08-2015, 10:12 AM	#8
not a gt Registered User Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Waaayy out in the country,leave your GPS at home! Posts: 4,825	Re: lost oil pressure Man sorry to hear this, I know you were just doing the oil sender..hopefully all is well inside... what was the circumstances when it went to zero?? Idling in garage, driving?? __________________ 2003 DSG Mach 1-03 Cobra Term/T56 swap: 2.3L Whipple,3.37 Upper,4 lb.lower, ID 1000 injectors,LCD cooling mod,Billetflow idlers,200A Alt,oil cooler delete with MMR adapter plate,MM oil filter kit,FrozenBoost Heat Exchanger Flowtech L.T., Maganaflow O/R X with Magnapacks, FRRP D.S.,T-56 with 26 spline input shaft and anti venom mod with reverse lockout box, FR steel flywheel,Spec Stage 3+,Moser 31 spline axles,FR 3.73 gear Tuned by B.Kurgan 601Hp/558/Tq

02-08-2015, 10:13 AM	#9
Zack Registered User Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: St. John, IN Posts: 689	Re: lost oil pressure Curious to hear your thoughts on how the balancer can break the gears. Sorry to hear bud

02-08-2015, 12:05 PM	#11
mach1z Registered User Join Date: May 2005 Location: Woodstock,GA Posts: 544	Re: lost oil pressure Makes sense to me, you are eliminating a forgiving rubber damper with a solid piece. __________________ I/E, 4:10's, tune

02-08-2015, 01:03 PM	#12
DSG2003Mach1 700 HP Mach Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 8,384	Re: lost oil pressure from the IW website, its not just a solid piece Inside the light weight billet aluminum cover is a free floating wet friction clutch pack assembly that utilizes spring loaded inertia rings to dampen crankshaft harmonics over a wide RPM range. The rings work in conjunction with clutches to provide outstanding dampening action. That action does generate some heat, and we use a small amount of fluid inside that acts as a lubricant as well as dissipates heat to the outer body. __________________ 03 dsg mach1 - MPR built 9.5:1 motor, D1, cams, ported intake, full exhaust, magnum t56, built rear, E85 etc... '12 F150 FX2 Supercrew with Ecoboost daily beater

02-08-2015, 02:25 PM	#13
mach1z Registered User Join Date: May 2005 Location: Woodstock,GA Posts: 544	Re: lost oil pressure Disregard then. I thought they were just machined parts. I would still try an ATI next if I was you, granted if moneys are there. __________________ I/E, 4:10's, tune

02-08-2015, 03:48 PM	#15
rugs04mach Registered User Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Long Valley, New Jersey Posts: 253	Re: lost oil pressure I'm worried as well. Does it make sense to pull the motor apart and replace the gears proactively? What kind of job/labor is it? Easier to do with motor out of car? __________________ Eibach Pro Kit springs Silver FR500 18x9 18x10 265/35/18 295/35/18 Vredestein's MGW shifter Borla Stinger cat back cobra mirrors Aluminator/Kenne-Bell American Racing headers/catted x pipe Mcleod RXT twin disc Built TR3650 by Astro Performance tuned by Chris Rose

02-09-2015, 03:56 PM	#17
Vndcatr SVT Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Northern California Posts: 812	Re: lost oil pressure ** man , that sucks to hear..What pump and gears did you go with ? Ive always had great luck with termys and twin screws on stock pumps.. It is hard to pinpoint things like this when nothing is stock anymore haha.. Hope it works out and no damage was done.. __________________ 2001 Zinc yellow SVT Cobra** Forged 11.5CR 284ci Comp 106500 cams - Degreed 01 cobra Heads - tastefully modded Roys ported/polished Intake Kooks longtubes, Magnaflow catback D&D T3650, Mgw shifted FTB Goodies, 4.30s, FRPP diff cover, 31 splined IRS 04 cobra interior , black termy seats, Speedhut gauges Tubular K, MM coilovers/ Koni SA yellows Starkweather tuned, 24* timing on 91 octane 11.7 @ 117mph 1.62 60ft. Raceweight 3200lbs Next up:Sullivan intake and hat, self tuning..

02-09-2015, 04:30 PM	#18
DSG2003Mach1 700 HP Mach Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 8,384	Re: lost oil pressure not sure what Im gonna do but leaning towards a TSS matched set of billet gears and pump __________________ 03 dsg mach1 - MPR built 9.5:1 motor, D1, cams, ported intake, full exhaust, magnum t56, built rear, E85 etc... '12 F150 FX2 Supercrew with Ecoboost daily beater

02-09-2015, 05:12 PM	#19
311-420 Can't be bridled Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Texas Posts: 7,006	Re: lost oil pressure Sorry to hear this dude. As you know, you're not even close to being the first to break those gears making that kind of power. Don't sweat it too much though. Everything balances. __________________ 2004 Mach 1 #6956 5spd w/IUP Eaton swap, longtubes, built 3.73 SRA 452hp/409tq dynojet🏁

02-09-2015, 07:19 PM	#21
01yellerCobra Registered User Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 1,104	That's why I went with the Melling when I built my engine. I've bwen running the ATI 12% overdrive with no issues. If you're looking for a crank pulley let me know. I don't need my ATI anymore and am looking to sell it. __________________ New Ride: 2004 Mystichrome Cobra-Accufab SBTB and plenum, Steeda 2.8" upper, Bassani X, Borla Stingers, Mcleod RXT, MGW shifter, Level 5 halfshafts, chrome FR500's, Stiffler's FIT system and DS safety loop, GT pumps, BA3000, tuned by owner

02-09-2015, 08:01 PM	#22
DSG2003Mach1 700 HP Mach Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 8,384	Re: lost oil pressure If it's an 8 rib shoot me a pride and I'll look into it...I think I can get away with that without really over spinning the blower... Was thinking at least a 10% over drive while this is going on.... Come back stronger than before __________________ 03 dsg mach1 - MPR built 9.5:1 motor, D1, cams, ported intake, full exhaust, magnum t56, built rear, E85 etc... '12 F150 FX2 Supercrew with Ecoboost daily beater

02-10-2015, 10:29 PM	#23
SuperMach1 Never Satisfied Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 1,134	Re: lost oil pressure D@mn man that really sucks @ss!!! Im procharged with the IW Overdrive balancer. I did go with MMR pump and billet gears, hopefully it works out. I would go with TSS also I've read only good things about them. __________________ P1 8psi @ 6k PA Transmission DD 3,600 Stall BBK LT's w/ 3in Collector Custom 3in X-Pipe Custom 3in CB w/ Pypes 3in M-80's Built Rear w/ 4:10 415/383 PB 11.80, @ 119 with a 1.71 60ft Tuned by http://www.southtexasperformance.com/ Built WAP Block, 10.5:1 compression, 14psi, E-85 Coming soon.

02-12-2015, 05:29 AM	#24
4vlover Registered User Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: connersville, IN Posts: 604	Re: lost oil pressure is it at 0 always? if its only under heavy throttle your pickup tube could be gunked up. I'm sure you know that though

02-12-2015, 08:06 AM	#25
DSG2003Mach1 700 HP Mach Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 8,384	Re: lost oil pressure It was zero on the mechanical gauge at idle __________________ 03 dsg mach1 - MPR built 9.5:1 motor, D1, cams, ported intake, full exhaust, magnum t56, built rear, E85 etc... '12 F150 FX2 Supercrew with Ecoboost daily beater

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