What about the one time limited 6500.
 

How do you feel about the new 2004 build of the mach1. I was told it was to be a one time 6500 unit build,which would make them quite rare,and valuable. I feel cheated,now that Ford has decided to build them for another year. Anyone interisted in a class action law suit? Remember the 1999 cobra suit,over the overated horsepower? I feel this falls under the same false advertising,as that action. PS. No,I'm not a lawyer,I happen to work for Fords,as a hourly employee,and build the motors for the mach 1's,at the Romeo eng.plant in Mi.

Happy,or pissed about the 2004 build?:confused:

There is a precident for the lawsuit. This same thing has happened to BMW (M5) and Ferrari (F40, I think) both had intended to make a run of cars that became so popular that it became in their best interest to up the final production and those who had bought these cars set up a class action suit. I don't know what the final results were.

Re: What about the one time limited 6500.
 

That doesn't change the fact that we all knew the Mach 1 model was going to be continued for the 2004 model year before anyone here got their car. Such info, straight from the CEO's office, was posted here by at least two members before the very first production Mach 1 rolled off the assembly line.

If it really bothered you, you certainly had the option to not buy.

Re: Re: What about the one time limited 6500.
 

I didn't even know about this board until after I bought my car. It isn't our job to research Ford's last minute change of advertisment ploy. I am in.

It does suck, in that we were misled, but even if the total produced for both years is 11,500, thats still limited.
I just recieved a Mach 1 brochure that I bought on Ebay that I believe was the Canadian brochure, as it's in Eng/French. To quote it directly, "The legendary, heart-pounding performance of the Mustang Mach 1 returns to the streets in a special limited edition for 2003" That's pretty direct..no misleading verbage there.
There is no printed date on this, it's a hard card 8.5 X 11 fold out with an Azure on the cover and a TR inside.

Oh well....
Cheryl

Well, the brochure I have, pretty clearly adds...

"Ford Division reserves the right to change product
specifications at any time without incurring obligations."

IMHO, there is a major difference between having the number of cars made in 2003 limited to just 6500, and having the car limited to just being made in 2003. I believe Ford was careful to only say the first, and not the second.

Did anyone actually verify with Ford, at time of their purchase, that the Mach 1 would not be continued for 2004?? If this point was so very important to one and to your enjoyment of your Mach 1, I would think that one has the duty to ask and verify it in light of their disclaimer. If one didn't bother, then IMHO, one doesn't have much just cause to complain now.

Just got back from Carlilse. We had a great time meeting and enjoying our cars. While I was there it occurred to me of all the models mustangs that were there from 64 1/2 on.........The Mach 1 is a collectable car......it's value will vary with the economy.....the people that trade the car in a few years will lose on the car as most cars do.....if you plan on having it 15-20 years, I believe you will get your investment back.

Bottom line......enjoy it and take care of it....what price do you put on the enjoyment you get when that shaker kicks to the right
:HOPPY:

Very will done right on:THUMBSUP: :CHEERS:

What you would need for a lawsuit
 

OK. As the resident lawyer, here's my two cents, NOT THAT I'M PROVIDING ANYONE WITH LEGAL ADVICE.

In order to entertain some form of lawsuit, we would have to show some sort of hard evidence that Ford led us to believe that there would be 6500 total. Vague references to the Bullitt wouldn't be enough. A press release, a statement quoting a particular person who would be reasonable to believe, etc. Then there's the issue of qualifying a class (which is easy to do, though not my area) under the federal rules of civil procedure.

Then, there's the question of damages. The Cobra situation was easy: The product was advertised as having x horsepower, and it did not. That can be quantified. In our situation, the class would potentially have to show that you wouldn't have bought the car but for (at leats in part) the limited production aspect, or perhaps that the price was inflated. Given that many (most?) of us would have bought anyway, and given that the price is probably justifyable even if they made more of them, it would be an uphill battle. Then what's the remedy? Money back? An injunction to stop production?

If people are unhappy, they should certainly consider these things, and consult a lawyer if you choose. I'm not a litigator, so perhaps an aggressive trial lawyer could make a case. If you can show me something explicit where Ford committs to 6500, then perhaps we should revisit the issue.

From my standpoint (and I've said it before), something like twelve million new cars were sold in the U.S. last year. Even if they double production, the Mach 1 is very rare. Also, keep in mind that Ford made tens of thousands of Mach 1s in 1969 and 1970 (not even counting 1971-1973). So, I still think we're ahead of the game.

Finally, add to the fact that it's a kick-*** car. Every morning on the way to work and every night on the way home I hop in the car and get a huge smile on my face. Been that way for six months now. Doesn't matter how tired, worn-out or annoyed I am. Darn car just makes me happy!!

Enjoy!

I, too, am not a lawyer...although my sister is (JAG) and I did not confer with her on this. Ford did state in it's press release in the New York Auto Show press kit that "Ford...will build 6,500 Mustang Mach 1 special editions..." as well as " Each Mach 1 will come with a unique serialization...to ensure exclusivity and collectibilty". Sounds like pretty solid evidence to me.

Number of Mach 1s produced, 1969-1978:

1969 -- 72,458

1970 -- 40,970

1971 -- 36,499

1972 -- 27,675

1973 -- 35,440

1974 -- 44,046

1975 -- 21,062

1976 -- 9,232

1977 -- 6,719

1978 -- 7,968

Make of it what you will.

You guys just clam down now we don't know how many are made now we wait at end of this model year of 2003 if Ford makes 3300 Mach1 this year , and Ford makes 3200 Mach1s in 2004 you ended up with 6500 Mach1s;) think about it.:COOL:

Ok, Lets try this again,

1969 Mach1.....they made 72,000.......at around $3,000

They are now worth 10 times that much............



If you bought it for an investment....wait it out........

If you bought to enjoy.just watch that shaker kick to the right:HOPPY: and flog it.........

So, if you paid $3,000 and it's worth $30,000, not counting what you'd have paid in maintainance, insurance, storage, etc., it would be worth about what it would cost for a new Mach 1.

Long post to follow...sorry.

Don't forget that you have to adjust for inflation. It's too easy to say something cost $3000 in 1969, so it would cost $3000 in today's market, too -- it's also wrong to say that. Because of inflation today's dollar is worth less than a dollar in 1969.

Here's a handy tool you can use to adjust for inflation without having to worry about what the CPI was for any given year:

http://minneapolisfed.org/research/data/us/calc/

A base model Mach 1 (no options) in 1969 cost $3,122 in 1969 dollars. If you were to buy that car new today it would cost you $15,653. Now, a classic car is worth exactly what someone is willing to pay for it, and the price fluctuates from year to year. That being said, the NADA classic car guide (found here http://www2.nadaguides.com/Values/Va...Sec=2&wPg=1202 ) tells us that a base model 69 Mach is worth $34,385 in like new condition in 2003 dollars. So your actual return on investment, adjusting for inflation is $18,732. And, as falcon pointed out, that doesn't include the cost of maintenance over 34 years, but still that ain't a bad figure.

As I noted above, there were 72,458 Machs made in 1969, out of a total of 299,824 Mustangs made that year. This means that Mach 1s accounted for just over 24% of production that year. I don't know how many total Mustangs they're likely to produce this year (2003), but I'd be willing to bet the 2003 Mach 1s will not account for 24% of production.

Oh, and for those who are curious, here are the numbers on a 1969 R code Mach 1 (I added the drag pak and the 4 speed manual tranny -- note that the presence of a manual tranny with a 428 ci engine meant that air conditioning was not an available option in 1969):

Retail cost (1969): $3,800
Retail cost (2003): $19,052
Value (2003): $55,470
Percentage of production: 4.4%

There were 13,193 Mustangs produced with the 428 CJ engine, but you didn't have to have a Mach to get it. The 4.4% above is the percentage of all R codes, not R code Mach 1s.

The most recent production numbers I could find were for 2001, when 155,162 Mustangs were rolled off the line. If this figure were to hold for 2003 (probably won't, but let's just suppose), and they were to produce all 6,500 Mach 1s this year, then our R code Machs will account for just 4.2% of production.

Funny how things work out.

Everybody play nice, now. :D

;)

OHMach1: Well said and interesting. I want a 1970 Mach!! :D

The other thing that occurs to me is that I'm just happy that Ford decided to make a really fun car. Now, I'd be disappointed if we had the problem that the Cobra did in '99 with horsepower. That's a functional deficiency. However, I think it's great they went to the effort to bring back the Mach and the Shaker, and bless 'em if they can sell a few more. :THUMBSUP:

Also, before anyone entertains a lawsuit, bear in mind that the message that Ford might hear could be to avoid the specialty car thing altogether. There are certainly corporate types who think that way. I know that some of my clients would take that as the lesson from a lawsuit of this nature.

Anyway, I'm curious how all this will turn out.

B.

Keep in mind that it if you want to speculate in the car market, you should never, ever buy a car new off the production line. It's all about knowing when to get into a particular type of car and when to get out. Ten to fifteen years ago you could have gotten a 69 or 70 Mach 1 (probably not an R code or Boss 429, but a Mach 1 nonetheless) for a song, and it probably would have been in excellent shape. When I bought my 71, the 71-73s weren't in demand at all, but I felt their time was coming. Now that parts are starting to be reproduced specifically for these years, I'm hoping I was right.

Here's what I love about my 71: as an M code, she had a comp. ratio of 10.7:1 off the showroom floor and would throw down 285 horses and a whopping 370 ft-lbs of torque...only the 429s of that year could top it, and by 72 they had de-tuned all of the engines down to an 8.6:1 -- even the 351 4V HO. Might make the M code desireable at some point, might not...but she sure is a balls to the wall ride! :HOPPY:

And that's the real reason why I bought her: she's a mean friggin' ride and because she's bigger than her 69 and 70 cousins she looks the part better.

And that's what I was hoping for when I ordered the 03. And that's what I got. Anybody who bought this car with even the most remote thought in the back of their minds that it might have a little more value if they traded it in a couple of years later because of it's limited production status is beyond my ability to comprehend.

The thing to keep in mind is that almost all cars depreciate in value initially. True collectability comes a little further down the road. If you wanted to maximize your investment, you should have bought one used and held onto it for twenty years without driving it. If you want to turn around and trade it in a couple of years from now, I don't know what to say to you because I can't fathom the concept when it comes to this car. Value is something that is determined by the possessor of a commodity and the person who wants to buy it from him.

Besides, when we all have to start pulling into the hydrogen station to fill up our cars, I doubt many of today's cars will have much more than sentimental value to any of us, anyway.:LAUGH:

:??: Dear Cheryl, 6500 + 6500= 1300. So,my question is, where did you get the 1150? By any chance,are you a Blonde? xoxox

Ummm...actually...6500 + 6500= 13000 :rolleyes:

Who's blonde now?:D :THUMBSUP:

:LAUGH: :p Somewhere on here, no, I'm not going to do a search for it, someone said they expected only about 5000 cars for '04.
6500 + 5000 = 11500. No one has given a firm number for '04, so I low-balled it. Felt this would be more accurate as they haven't even sold all the '03's

As for being blonde....my hair is natural raven black and down to my waist....BUT...my father was blonde ;)

For what it's worth this is my story on the subject. I've got an 88 LX Coupe that I paid too much for a couple of years ago, I traded a 2000 Dodge Dakota R/T with a 360 that I bought new the last week of 1999 that screamed, and before it a 1997 30th anniversiary edition Z28 6 speed stick with white leather that had 7 miles on it when I got it. Now I got a new Azure Mach that had 5 miles on it in the showroom when I picked it up. My friends think I'm crazy for what I have spent on cars but as far as I'm concerned I'm just glad that I've had the opportunity to enjoy these little mothers during the time I've spent on God's nice planet. Keep rockin' people life is short. Play hard and don't bite the hand that feeds ya:THUMBSUP:

Legal issues aside, I just dig the car! :D

Lets think about it in another way. There are a lot of people who haven't seen or even know of the 2003 Mach 1. How often do you guys se one on the road. I look for them when I am out and maybe see one every couple of weeks. And I live 15 miles from where they are built! Compared to the Mach SS's and Vettes are commonplace on the road. I see more Vipers than Machs (What does that tell you). Even with the 2004 production it will still be a rareity.

When people start seeing them more, thier interest will be peaked. One benefit of the increased production will be increased exposure for the car. It is my feeling that as more people see it, hear about its performance, and realize that 2004 will be the last year of the platform, demand will increase in the end.

The 11500 combined 2 year production number is still very , very low. Enjoy the ride.

GiddyUp!

:THUMBSUP: