Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Cams, springs and retainers all done. Car sounds good - revs quicker. Just need to get chip re-done to add more fuel. Springs a must in my fathers opinion - he did the install. Stock springs very weak and near coil bind with FR500 Cams. Even without coil bind - they are too weak to support high rpms without some float. Will be a week or 2 before I go to track again - off to Florida.

http://www.aglobalmart.com/Mach/MOV00026.MPG



I have another problem left over from last time to track. Our track shuts down for the winter - saw no need to work on it until now. When I ran the 12.17 - car died on the 3-4 shift - also died on 2-3 shift earlier that day - would have been a great pass. It is electrical - will replace battery - if that does not do it - replace the computer. Gauges peg out every now and then as well - all started the last TNT day.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Get that badboy on a dyno and get some track numbers! :yeh:

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

What did the cams cost you??

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

$1100, but kit not perfect for those who are not rebuilding heads. The springs that come with kit require you use the valves that come in kit. Valves are same length, but lock grooves are higher than stock. I had to buy Comp Cams springs and retainers to work with stock groove valves. I have someone buying the springs and valves out of the kit, but looks like I'll still be out about $1100 for cam and springs - not bad if you shop around.

Not sure if Ford Racing will sell cams separately, but that would be the way to go. Then buy your own springs from Comp Cams.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Good luck with the cams. I'll be awaiting some track results. :yeh:

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Sounds good!!!

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

I will post track times after I get the tune right.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

What are the specs of those cams been looking forever cant find them. Either thoose or stag2 comps going in my pony. I think.... the procharger caught my eyes to got to deciede. Nice car though sounds great.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Can't wait to hear the car in person MachOneThis. Are you going to take it to Dynospeed Racing and them tune the car with SCT software?

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Matt -

I would like to talk to them about what they offer. Will get an air/fuel reading today to see how far off with current tune.

Cam specs: lift .480, intake duration 258°, exhaust duration 254°, 109° center line. Those duration numbers are advertised; at .050 duration is down around 214/204. Great for Mach stock intake - any more could do more harm than good performance wise.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Some install info for those who want to know. Sorry -I just could not write a step by step without writing a book.

This pic is of air tool in spark plug hole. Used 100psi of pressure to hold up valves while changing springs. I made the air tool - common parts - the 14mm spark plug end was purchased from a parts store in the help section - it is a 14mm oil foul adapter.

http://www.aglobalmart.com/Mach/air.jpg

Misc pictures of how I marked the sprockets. If you put the mark on crank sprocket at 6:00 o'clock then the cams sprockets marks go at 12:00 o'clock in relationship to valve cover surface. No marks needed if using the 6 & 12 o'clock method. Marking the sprockets before pulling can actually keep you from having to care about where everything is located. Be sure to mark both long chains at the 6 o'clock spot on crank gear. I cleaned all the gears with paint thinner so paint would stick. You will notice that I did not mark the large sprocket (green paint) at twelve o'clock. I marked the chain and sprocket using the timing mark on sprocket from factory. That is where that mark ends up if you have the crank sprocket at 6:00 o'clock and the cams at 12:00 o'clock.

http://www.aglobalmart.com/Mach/sprockets.jpg
http://www.aglobalmart.com/Mach/sprockets1.jpg

Tensioner on long chains is mostly hydraulic - after removing, you can use a c clamp to compress - that removes all the oil and will reinstall by hand without clamp or locking in place.

http://www.aglobalmart.com/Mach/tensioner.jpg

Tensioner on small chains have a small hole that allows you to insert something to hold compressed. I used a c clamp to compress then inserted a small allen wrench. I did not remove these tensioners from motor.

http://www.aglobalmart.com/Mach/tenlock.jpg

Tools I used to install valve springs - takes a lot of patience. Valve locks have to be put in with telescopic magnet while compressing spring with one hand. Walk away every now and then and come back. The pick tool help me position locks. You will notice that I picture both 2V and 4V spring tools - the 2V tool actually did the exhaust easier than the 4V tool. 2V tool will not do intake springs. If you don't want to buy both tools - buy the 4V tool. I figured I would buy both and sell after the job - probably get most of my money back - they are somewhat expensive - $200 for both.

http://www.aglobalmart.com/Mach/tools.jpg

I found no 4V articles online where anyone installed springs with heads on car. I did find one where someone did it on a 2V motor - a lot easier and half as many parts.

Many have had trouble getting the brake booster off the firewall. There is one nut on the bottom left on the firewall. Long extension and a knuckle joint works great. There are three nuts inside under the dash - top left hardest one. I removed the electric switch which revealed the 4th bolt. The switch is easy to remove with a pair of needle nose pliers on the back side of switch.

Passenger side valve cover - remove heater lines from firewall - was able to press locks and remove by hand with no special tools. Remove fuel line - plastic fuel line tool does that job. Loosen the fuel rail - I did not remove, but would have helped some.

Many put rockers on new cams before bolting cams in place. I did it the hard way and I think the best way. I bolted the cams in place and used spring tool to put them back on - slow, but no chance of breaking a cap. If you do put all the rockers in place on the cams and bolt caps on - tighten all the caps in very small even increments bringing them down slowing to prevent breaking a cap.

I did buy all new gaskets - about $35 for front cover and valve covers. Just could not see risking an oil leak after all that work. Used a small spot of black rtv wear heads meet block and where timing cover meets heads. Ford does the same thing - you will see where they used rtv. I also put a very small bead on oil pan gasket to be sure no problems.

Hardest Part of the job:

No doubt - valve springs

Other than that - just getting the valve covers off and leaving enough room to work on springs. Exhaust springs are the hardest since they are at the bottom. No shortcuts if you plan on doing the springs - brake booster does need to come off - some just loosen enough to get covers off - will be in the way of getting to springs. I would not do a cam swap without springs - the stockers are very weak which could hurt high rpm horsepower.

I did remove the water pump - we have the electric pump and was in the way of front cover. Stock water pump does not have to be removed. Also removed the water resorvoir tank and electric fan. Fan probably could stay - I just wanted all the room I could get for balancer removal.

I would not install cams unless you have headers and free flowing exhaust. Cams can actually hurt performance with stock exhaust.

I have seen articles where people say our heads do not benefit from cams without porting - bull. I have never seen a head on a flow bench that it did not flow more with higher lift than stock and that is true for the Mach heads. You will make more power - it's just a question of how much. Things that might make the install show no gains - improper install - poor exhaust system - failure to re-tune for proper air/fuel. If a motor is on the rich side before install - you might be dead on after the install with no tune, but needs to be checked. Remember - cams put more air into motor - more fuel is also needed.

Important Note About 4V Cams

All four cams are different. There is a right and left intake and exhuast cam. You must keep up with which one you pull and match to correct new cam. I did not see any markings on the new cam stating what they were. I just pulled one out of the motor and layed it on a counter top side by side with a new one. You have to match them up by lobe placement - easy to do and they differ enought to keep from getting confused. Some brands mark them for you, but I would still lay side by side to make sure.

For the very technically minded:

Degreeing the cams - a degree wheel and a dial indicator is needed. Top dead center is very easy since sparkplug right over top of piston. Other than checking - I would not degree unless I found a huge error in one of the cams or sprockets. To properly degree all four cams - you may need multi indexed sprockets for the four cams and the crank. I could not find anyone who sells the indexed sprockets. This is one reason I chose Ford cams - they are pretty close. Keep in mind that these motors over a period of time will retard the cams as the long chains wear - not much, but will occur. Stock sprockets can have new indexed slots cut by a machinist - be sure to check his work.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Awesome!! You've given hope to those that don't want to get blown!

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

I've been thinking about going witht he comp cams. I was wondering how long the install took.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

MachOneThis,

Nice job on the cam install, it sounds good!!!!!

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Thanks everyone -


Checked the air fuel and it was 13.5 under wide open throttle up to about 5000 - did not take it higher. Would like to get it down in th 12.6 rqange. I might run it like it sits - 13.5 a little lean but should not hurt anything. My chip has a lower setting that is 1% richer - if I run without getting the chip reflashed - I'll probably use that lower setting. The lower setting only adds 2 degrees of timing - would like more, but will have to wait for reflash.

A 4th gear punch on the expressway from about 3000 is how I took the a/f readings. I have an onboard wideband A/F digital setup on the car. Seat of the pants felt a lot stronger than stock cams in 4th gear. 4th gear was where we wanted to get most of our improvement since we are running a 4.56 gear - we are in 4th before the 1/8 mile mark.

Need to have axle tubes welded this week and see about getting the chip richened up. Chip company is out of town - that is why I may run it as is - I was not going to run if a/f was 14.00 or higher. I'll try to get to the track this week.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

I would allow 3 days for cam and springs so you can work leisurely but steady. I stopped every now and then just to get a rest and clean up my work space. Cams without springs could be done in 1 - 1½ days leisurely. The springs really slowed down the amount of time needed.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Wow! I don't know how i missed your sound clip, but the car sounds SWEET!! I think hearing that has convinced me to buy cams for my car (when i get it running again that is).

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Great write-up. Kinda reminds me of the 'net back in the day.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

I've been reading about yours - hope it's OK. Yeah - I decided on cams so I can quit trying to get an eleven no more than I go to the track. I think a lot of Mach 1s like yours will obviously run an eleven in the right air at the right track. I think most of the ones that have run an eleven did it with air density that was below sea level. It is easy to check - just need to know date they ran and were then head to Accuweather.com. Weather is relevant - now my goal is to run elevens even on a hot day.

Good luck with yours - let us know what happened - might help us.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Interesting reading Johnny. I hope these cams help you get to where you want to be with your Mach! See you at TnT Thursday hopefully!!

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

do you have any #'s? was there a big power difference?

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

I am trying to get car ready to run Thursday night.

I have the air fuel close enough to run, but will be running timing a little low. Should be another tenth or so in it after I get the tune closer. I'm just hoping the track conditions will be good enough to compare to pre-install. There is no doubt that it is making more power. Just hoping for traction and no head wind - our track faces north - a lot of north winds still around.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

You know there is rarely traction at MMP & the weather is looking questionable (30% chance of rain according to the Weatherbug). I hope it's wrong!! :3:

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Your right Matt - if weather is too questionable, I'll wait until a better day.

I do not understand why a track that nice will not prep for TNT nights. Most of us would pay another $5 entry for a prepped track.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

I'm going to wait till it's closer before I decide to stay at home. It's just disappointing the weather isn't sounding great. I'm less than .1 seconds from a 12 second pass with only an O/R h-pipe, PHP intake spacer & drop in K&N. I want my 12!!! I've got an updated tune in the Predator & want to see if that can push me over the edge... :yes:

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Great right up man.. That just makes me want to go get a set of cams and install them... I know me and all of my Motor head friends over here shouldn't have a problem installing them.. But those springs do look to be a MOFO to install... Great Job and it sounds awesome...

Dan

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Thanks Dan -

Cam install easy, but cannot begin to tell anyone how tough those springs were - putting the keepers is a killer.

You're from Texas - Louise would be mad if you got cams - wouldn't she? LOL

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

She is already mad at Me.. Thats my main compition around here.. We go to the track all the time.. Do you know the part number for the springs your ordered from CompCams... And how much were they.. Thanks Man... Now I'm thinking about do this too.. Smokey is going to be a bad MoFo when I get finished with him..

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Dan

Spring part number was 26123-32 - I paid $377.60 - not sure if that is good or not. I was short on time once I found out the Ford Springs were too tall.

Retainers (required - cannot use stockers) part number 799-32 - I paid $99.84

Good luck - you already have a fast Mach - Cams and he'll make a lot of folks mad.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Thanks alot.. I think I know what I will be doing to Smokey come this summer.. :yes:

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

i just though i would mention. that you dont need to paint all the chains and gears. if you look in your pics you will see some dark colored chain links. those line up with the dots on the cam and crank gears when engine is at tdc #1 but your way works just as good.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

I did use all the factory marks after getting true dop center on the firing stroke for number one cylinder. You can see in the painted pics that factory marks are visible. Chains do not have to be marked at all when all sprockets are positioned. Just did that for everyone else - can use that method even without proper positioning of timing marks. The position of timing marks are the most important concern - crank sprocket at 6:00 and cam sprockets at 12:00 in relationship to head and the chains then do not matter. I guess just to be sure, I'll make this point even clearer. When I say 6 & 12 o'clock - I am speaking of the timing mark on the sprockets - not the keyway. Thanks -

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Wow. That sounded Awsome. I can't wait. I having my Crower Stage 2's done in about 2 weeks so I can't wait until then. But I really want to see what it's going to be like after Jerry from SCT tunes the car in April. Should be a fun ride down the track now. Looking for that 11.99 pass. Can't wait to see what your car turns in 1/4. Post it up. -Stick-

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

The install don't sound to bad..has anyone thrown any boost at a mach with the Ford high lift cams.
RJW

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Not that I know of, but would be awesome. I would want forged pistons and rods for that mod.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Just wondering would we/I still be safe with only 8 psi boost?

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Stay under 10 pounds and keep the A/F in the high 11s to low 12s and you should be fine.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

An update -

Took the car to the track tonight for my son. Track was absolutely horrible. I did not see one pro car stay it it for a full run. MattN03 from the registry was there in his 13.00 Mach - he was sideways when he hit 2nd and had to lift. I usually dry hop before staging at 5000 RPM - if it hooks real good - I leave higher. Did not even try to hook behind the line so I left below 5000. I spun all the way through 1st & 2nd; even spun a little hitting 4th. Amazingly still pulled off a 12.17 at 112 plus. Yeah go figure - that is what it ran late last fall except MPH was lower (lower horsepower on stock cams) - it also hooked last fall. These cams really do pull much harder - 60 foot was way off - 1.71 - 330' way off (almost a tenth off) - by the 1/8th it had recovered enough from spinning to run 7.70s and finsihed out with the 12.17. I only ran 20 degrees of timing tonight - good thing I did not run more. There is a lot of ET left laying there -


A little about the car -

Race weight was 3460, car has stock intake - throttle body - heads and short block. Stock seats up front - air conditioner still hooked up and working. We drive it to and from the track. Other major mods are full exhaust - C&L CAI - 4.56 gear - Pro Star Rims with ET Streets - front suspension.

Weather

It was cool - 50 degrees, but the barometer sucked - 29.83 - lowest barometer we have seen on TNT - usually 30.15 - 30.30. A few weeks ago the barometer was 30.73, but track closed. Actually good that barometer was low - if it had been higher - just would have spun more.

Guess we will give the track a few more weeks before trying again. They usually scraped it clean every year and it hooks like crap for a few weeks. Of course - would not kill them to give up a little VHT - they think its' gold.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Johnny, I ran one more time after you left, and it was just as bad. I hit 2nd, and the car was all over the track. I had to lift, so it killed my ET. I think I'm going to call Memphis Motorsports tomorrow and :anger: a little about the track never being sprayed. I wonder if it'll do any good??? It's to the point where it's dangerous because a car could go any which way when they launch!! :grr:

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

MachOneThis, Your matching FR500 Intake is on ebay !!!

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

I'll have to check that out - money money money

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Try this - for those who have run ET Streets - should be able to tell by launch rpm that I did not launch high. I did a dry hop right before staging and car was spinning bad so I keft below 5000. You can hear it spin all the way through first gear. This was first pass with cams. The lightning in the left lane ran a 13.70 best - his previous best was 13.01 - track horrible - I just went home. Most everyone just went home - no good runs.

Might have to right click and save to play depending on your media player.

http://www.memphislightnings.com/videos/MachThis.mpg

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Doesnt look any worse than my track on any given street nite?? Did you "prepare" those tires at all other than the "dry hop" you speak of?? You really didnt spin that bad concidering the 4.56 gear?? What was your tirepressure?? A little spin to keep the RPM's up isnt to bad.. IMO only giving the track 1 pass is like going to the amusement park & only riding the carousel once.. Seriously, ive been to a really "BAD" track nite.. By nites end ive got the tirepressure, suspension, struts, shocks dialed in to the point where it almost doesnt matter.. The 10.5 PSI & softest setting with struts can in itself cure alot & only lose about a tenth max at that adjustment. :smokin:

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Rodney

We always let about 30 minutes of time trials go by before we make a pass just to clean the track up. We would have stayed and worked with it, but it was not just us. If it was not for ET Streets and leaving lower - we could not have run what we did. Had about 11.6 pounds of air in tires - no tubes. Did do a good burnout - no hook behind the line at all on dry hops - that's whay I decided to leave low and just put in a good pass. That L in the other lane made three passes - 13.70-14.40. His best was 13.01 from last year. MATTN03 was there from the Registry - he ran a 13.59 best when he ran 13.00s a few weeks ago. No sense in putting wear and tear on car just to leave at a low RPM. Good luck with your cams.

Burnout baby

http://www.memphislightnings.com/videos/burnouts.mpg

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Come on down to Memphis anytime 03AV8R and try out our track yourself. :smack:

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

I understand.. Personally i will be looking at my times between the 1/8th & 1/4 with my new cams.. This will be most important to me.. my track with its totally new surface is going to be so green come Apr. 1st that i know the launches & 60's are going to be terrible.. People will prolly leave too..

On my tracks worse day of the season my ET between the 1/8th & 1/4 is still approx. 4.3 Sec... If i put in new cams & granny the girl off the line, miss 2nd gear (on Apr. 1st) i will still have a good understanding of where my car is at if my ET between the 1/8th & 1/4 is on my slip, which it will be.. i will jujst ignore the first 1/8th of the track.. A 4.3 or 4.2 or 4.1 sec ET between the 1/8th & 1/4 will tell me alot.. Its ALWAYS about the same regardless of track or any mistakes i mighta made. :smokin:

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Did you check your ET between the 1/8th & 1/4?? Track shouldnt really change the time from the 1/8th onward.. It never does on my slips.. If i was 2 tenths quicker in the second half of the track with new cams (than i EVER was before) i think id wanna know that.. If your ET is exactly as it was prior to cams for the 2nd half of track id wanna know that too.. Just a thought. :smokin:

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Keep in mind im not trying to start any trouble here.. (no really im not).. Im just rationalizing what id do with new expensive cams at the track & aparantly it is different from you dudes..

If i was at a super crappy track with a new set of cams id be like well when in Rome do some testing.. Let em all leave cause thatll just leave me with more track time to myself & my new cams.. Id completely ignore the times for first 1/8th & concentrate on the 2nd half of track (its why i bought my cams in the first place)

Ive got 500 slips with 4.3's & 4.2's between the 1/8th & 1/4.. Even on the worst days its right in that ballpark.. Have i ever hit a 4.1?? Nope.. Would i be trying tonite with my new cams (most expensive single mod to date) Yup!!

You couldnt have gotten a TEAM of Mustangs & 4 Hooters girls to drag me away from that track that nite.. Your just need to get to 4th gear basically & flooring it to see what the new cams have done for ya on the slips. The slips dont lie much between the 1/8th & 1/4 :smokin:

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

Rodney

I think it is commendable how analytical you are with your runs. I always was as well when I raced every week. I raced the car for Michael while he was in Florida. I raced 7 & 8 second cars for 20 years - heads up - whatever - I do know a track that is so bad it is dangerous - I'm just lucky that I have enough experience to make a good pass out of a bad situation. Many people lifted the other night - some almost wrecked. I'm serious when I said I did not see one pro car stay it for a complete run. I could be wrong, but under the circimstances the 12.17 was very good and 20 more passes would not have told me anymore. The car was .040 off at the 1000 ft mark compared to a run last year with same ET, but managed to equal the ET in 320 more feet - that says it all. This car has never been entered in a bracket race - just gets to go to TnT for fun and play. Michael is looking forward to putting me down - he weighs 80lbs less than I.

I remember when I was at the point you are - keep it up - you are on a good track. These motors can easily run 11.50s or lower all day long NA with very little work.

Re: Ford Racing Cams Installed - WOW!!!!!
 

You had me pretty good till this last section of the reply?? (11.50's, Little work, N/A, all day long). I just aint seeing that on the 1/4 mile list? Not seeing it over at the corral either.. maybe 12.0's :)