To drag radial or not to drag radial that is the question?

[maddad52]

I have upgraded my mach with a full exhaust system and
have alittle more hp/torque now. the stock tire's don't hook
very well, i'am spining through 1st and 2nd and bark into
3rd. am thiniking about some drag radials to help me with
this problem. I have heard good and bad things about these
drag radials like, you don't get much mileage (duh!), they pickup
every thing etc..... I Need to hear from my mach bro's what
you think! The car is not a daily driver, i only drive on my days
off and if the weather is good. I have never been to a race
track, but am looking forward to going and seeing what the
car will do. ( need a time slip). Any other help geting this car
to hook better will be nice too!

Thanks, Maddad52:COOL:

[BlkMachWon]

You could buy an extra pair of wheels for $250 (real Ford Mach 1 wheels, not aftermarket), and mount the drag radials for special occasions while keeping your stock tires and wheels as well.

Just a thought as that's what I'm going to do here soon.

Post result when you get the drag radials on, like to hear about them.

[jbrad88]

Personally, If I am going to run the car at the track for et's I am not going to waste the money on the drag radials. They offer a compromise between a full street tire, and a sticky dot legal slick like the et streets from mickey thompson.

They will work better than a stock tire, but there is soooooo much more to making the car hook than just a sticky tire.

with the factory front tires, the sway bar connected, the lack of gearing (4.10's and up) and the weight of the car, the amount of front end lift is going to be minimal, and even though the drag radials are a good tire, I do not think they are worth the money myself...unless of course you are going to set the suspension up just for using them the way the class racers do...

Personally, I would go with one of the 17x9 aftermarket versions of the magnum, and put a good 275 40 on that wheel and learn to drive with the street tires alone. When you have gotten good at street tire performance, you have truly accomplished something...JMHO

[Ralph Greene]

Like Blk above says...good extra set of rear wheels cheap, and mount some DR's them to drive to the strip.

I have run 15" BFG DR's and 17" Nitto DR's before.

The BFG's by far hook the best, would probably last only 2000-3000 miles on the street, and you best park it if the stteets are wet, or be super careful and go slow. To me they are strip only. But at least you can drive them to the strip, (they don't sway around like bias ply ET Streets) so you're not changing tires in this heat, and then chaining your good wheels to a post or something.

The Nitto's start life with 6/32's thread (VS 10/32 for conventional tire), have fewer thread blocks to channel water than conventional tires, but can be used for normal use if you're careful. They don't hook as well as the BFG's, but some report up to 10,000 miles of life.

The 275X40X17 Nitto DR's also run a tad small, and work really good at the striip on stock 17X8 wheels at about 1/2 pressure. Handling is only fair on the street at normal pressure (they are a slight tire/wheel) mismatch), but handling is tolerable if you're a drag racer first, and into handling second.

Sure they're sticky, and when new do pick up a lot of trash, but after a few heat cycles that gets better.

[jbrad88]

Ralph...


Kind of figured you could not pass this one up...:)

[Ralph Greene]

JB...I really agree with you about one thing here. If I was going to change tires at the strip, I would just run slicks. Better yet, I would get 4 light weight Bogarts wheels and run skinnies on the frnt and slicks on the rear. That would probably remove well over 100 lbs weight. Or better yet, just get a trailer.

This is just my view, but like JB says, if you are just running T and T nights a few times, learn to drive your stock tires. If you buy race wheels, get ones that really work.

Like you, I think DR's work OK (especially the 15" ones), but for the street, and in the rain, I don't like them. I think they are dangerous. Lots of wrecks and spinouts reported on Corral from guys using DR's.

[vanstang]

I bought a 01GT on Jan. 4, 2001, March 01 I bought 2 extra rims and a pair of Nitto's(175x40x17) When I traded my 01 GT for the 03 Mach 1, I kept the drag radials. During the summer I would have the drag radials on the GT; during the winter I would put the factory tires back on.

As I type, I have the same drag radials on the Mach 1. I never had a problem with handling or anything else with the Nitto's.

If you drop the Nitto's down to 17psi and heat the tires up; you would sware you had slicks on your car.

You do not have to change your rearend to support these tires. Your clutch will go before anything else will.

When the temparature is over 80 degrees these tire stick like bubble gum. When the temperature is cool these tires slide like KY Jelly. :D

[jbrad88]

Ralph,

When I first saw the Mach in Tulsa last year I told myself that if I got one, I would do 4.10's, drive shaft loop, scattershield, skinnies, axles/posi , slicks, etc...

I got the car, drove it, and realized that as long as I have the coupe, the mach might see gears, but that is just for fun, not for the track. especially when you consider no one makes a skinny for the 13'' brakes, no one makes a scattershield for the 3650, and I am not too keen at this point in the cars life to start drilling holes in the floor for the loop, and so on and so on...

I figure the mach is safe as long as the coupe lives...

I am like you...Too nice a car to do that to, and been there done that...

I might look into the 17x9 wheels from the aftermarket for the quality and perhaps go with the 275 /40 combo on those wheels...then again... maybe not...

[Ralph Greene]

JB...I'm with you. I had a race car, and got tired of it. Only mods I'm really interested in for this car are just things that make it drive nicer, and maybe look nicer.

If I wanted a race car, I just would get an old 4 cylinder notch back Fox car. And go from there. Or just buy someone else's old race car and upgrade. A car someone else already spent thousands on.

[jbrad88]

I am working on trying to get the coupe back from the brink also. I am trying to get it back to the status of a really nice driver. I have upgraded the rear brakes, and I have the front brakes from a 1998 cobra ready to go on. I am going to go thru the car completely and really make it into a nice driver again...It deserves it after 14 years of abuse and 600+ passes...Car is still in good shape, just needs a lot of stuff...

[Jim P]

I have had nittos on several cars. 16" and 15". All the cars had suspension on them but the tires performed well. I personally never kept a car long enough to wear them out so I couldnt tell you how long they last. I know the largest amount of miles I have put on them was around 7000 and they still looked good. I couldnt tell a handling problem with them. I will buy more to go on my Mach. I have never ran BFG's. I hear they hook really good but dont last long.


for none believers in the Nittos, there is a guy here with an LS1 and a bottle cutting consistant 1.6 sixty foot times on nittos and even getting some 1.59's. Pretty good out of a drag radial.

[maddad52]

Thanks everybody for your help and the info. your right about
this car being to nice to turn into a race car, but i do want to
run the car at the track at lease a couple of times.
again thanks for the info and keep it coming! the feedback i
get from you guys really helps me make up my mind what i
wan't to do with my car. the car only has 1200 miles on it so
i'm in no hurry to do anything to it. Anyhow the mach has two
coats of zaino on it and has been siting in the garage for 5 days,
and i'm off from work tomorrow so you know what that means.

later, maddad52:CHEERS:

[Phil]

I would say run the Mach with your factory tires for a couple nights at the track. You just might surprise yourself. Having just the right amount of wheel spin (just a little) off the line and than hitting 2nd at 5800-6000 rpms really gives you a nice hole shot. You can do everything you can to acheive the best start possible but, if your 2nd and 3rd shift is not good, you just killed your E.T. With these cars you have room for error at the 60' mark but, with a good crisp 2nd & 3rd power shift at the right rpm, you will still be able to hit very respectable ET's. Mid 13's !

After having a dozen or so runs under your belt, you should now have a routine down where you do everything the same. Then try the different tires. That would be the best way to compare any improvements or possibly none at all.

[03AV8R]

My Mach 1 seems to only have 1 "Weak Link" for me.. The street tires DO NOT hook up.. I have to feather the clutch and work the throttle to the point where it just doesnt seem like id ever get a good 60Ft. time at the strip.. So today i ordered a new pair if 17X9 Rims to mount the new pair of BF Goodrich Drag Radials 274/40 R17's.. Im thinkin after some other future mods its really gonna need these tires.. A quick swap before i leave on my 1 mile journey to the drags will be worth it to me.. Maybe with more seat time i could make the streeters work but by then theyd be bald! The "tire specialists" seem to think if you heat up the street tires doing a pre-burnout at the track they actually get worse and spin more! The crowd may like it and the guy driving thinks its a hoot but you actually make 60 ft. & ET's worse.. The drag radials dont have this problem, Heat em up to 200 Deg. and watch em hook.. :THUMBSUP:

[Joe]

I have to agree with Ralph and John's comments about the Mach being such a nice car why go and start breaking things. My dad was an old school drag racer in the days of big blocks, slicks and welded axles. He still says to this day , that once you start using slicks or real sticky tires, something is going to break. I agree that its frustrating to try and hook up street radials at the track, but like John said, practice, practice.....practice. Paul Savincki drives the piss out of the Mach on street tires. He changes to the racing tires and gets killer times, but he still gets good times out of the streets. Maybe its just me, but this Mach hooks so much better than my 00 GT did with the same tires. You just can't launch this car at 4 grand and expect the tires to grip......

Good luck and have fun.

Joe

:HOPPY:

[03AV8R]

Joe, i do not disagree with you totally here but it just so happens my Dad is an old school dragger too! Oxford Plains Speedway in Oxford, Me.. I basically grew up at the track with him.. Slicks back then and those real "slicks" of today are a bias ply tire running on 6 to 12 PSI of air basically.. The more "wrinkle" at take-off the cooler you were. (we didnt have much back then) And Yea with 8 PSI Slicks at WOT things are gonna break! Running these on the rear & Radials on the front is extremely unstable and is why they invented the Drag "Radials" in the first place. You cannot compare the new modern Drag Radials to ANY slick of any era.. Slicks are Bias Ply tires and a totally different monkey, Great for Full time Draggin "Trailered Cars" never meant for the street. Drag Radials are like regular performance streeter Radials only better for dragging in that they are made to be "heated up" to any degree of "stickiness" the guy feels at that moment he needs.. IE: if its cold out, burn em good and make em sticky, if its already pretty hot out do a small burn to get the same effect.. There are those out their that have the (temperature setting burnout) so well "dialed in" that they swear they have real "Slicks" on the beast at launch.. :THUMBSUP:[/url]http://www.bfgoodrichtires.com/bfgapp/experts/articles/06182003sportscar.jsp

[jbrad88]

It really is about compromises. A car set up to run slicks and skinnies will have to make some compromises to handle all that traction. You will replace u-joints on a regular basis. You will need to go thru the rearend at least 1x a year. You will have to deal with a clutch going out, or tearing up a torque box etc.

The drag radial is a great tool to help the average JOE who does not want to go with a full drag set up have a slightly better than average street tire. Do they work? Sure they do. Especially on cars like ours that do not make a lot of torque naturally aspriated (compared to the 5.0's that made almost the same torque with 80 fewer horses. Can you leave the line at 6000 rpm and maximize your 60ft times? No. Can you get better traction in 1st and 2nd than a stock street tire? Yes.

My point on the drag radial question is that they are a compromise. Don't expect the same level of traction and CONSISTENCY that are offered by a slick. Since most of us run et bracket classes, not heads up racing, we need the consistency and repeatability to go rounds. There were days where I was able to drive the coupe to within .005 on every pass. That was with a 5-speed. I had weekends at FFW here in Baytown where I made 10 passes and 8 were the exact same et. (unfortunatly not usually in eliminations).

Some of that was me, but most of it was the car and the way I had it set up, and the Big Bad Mickey Thompson et drags...All I had to do was make sure the tires were at the same pressure. That I left the line at the same rpm, and I shifted at the same rpms (and did not miss)...The rest was suspension and a consistent simple engine combo...

[Tomcat427]

I went with Weld Prostar XP Rims:

"16 in. x 8 1/2 in., 5 x 4 1/2 in. and 5 x 4 3/4 in. dual-drilled bolt circle, 5 1/2 in. backspacing, forged aluminum, polished finish, Pro Star XP wheel"

And BFG drag radials:

"Vendor: BFGoodrich
Product Line: BFGoodrich Comp T/A Drag Radial Tires
Diameter: 26.1 in.

The world's first radial-ply D.O.T. street-legal drag racing tire.

P255/50R-16, Comp T/A Drag Radial, tire

BFGoodrich has designed a tire that combines the sticky tread compound of traditional bias-ply D.O.T. style drag tires with the handling and ride of a radial. The Comp T/A Drag has a competition-developed tread design that resists distortion, squirm, and chunking (pieces of tire coming off) to hook you to the asphalt. A special nylon cap ply gives you a consistent footprint for maximum traction off the line plus high speed stability through the win lights. And the steel belts and radial construction give you great handling and ride comfort, plus increased life compared to bias-plies."

[Tomcat427]

Depending on the weather I am going to an 1/8 mile track tomorrow night to get some seat time. I am going to a 1/4 track on Friday night.

Drove on them for about 60 hwy miles today. Ride was just fine, noise level was up a notch but was not too bad.

Can't wait for my control arms to get here:D

[Phil]

Sounds good! keep us posted. What was the cost for rims and tires?

[03AV8R]

Mine were $800 for everything brand new mounted and balanced.. BF Goodrich 275/40 R17's Drag Radials on New Cobra 9" wides. Special Occasions only.. Its only Money, you cant take it with ya! :)

[03AV8R]

Mine were $800 for everything brand new mounted and balanced.. BF Goodrich 275/40 R17's Drag Radials on New Cobra 9" wides. Special Occasions only.. Costs less than the 6 extra tires & rims i needed for my 6 wheeler to convert over to a "tracked" snowcat in the winter. Its only Money, you cant take it with ya! :)

[Tomcat427]

Rims $221.95
Lug Nuts $32.85 (have 2 extra)
Tires $150 (including mount, balance, valve stems)

Total with tax and shipping is approx: $825

[Tomcat427]

When I got home tonight it was raining. No practice before Friday:rolleyes:

I will post results from Friday night:D